NOT a Good Reason to Deny (Consanguineous) Love #17

“Consanguineous sex, relationships, or marriage ruins, confuses, or distorts family relationships.” First of all, this does not apply to adoptees who reunite as adults, or people who resulted from gamete or embryo donation. They already have families.

People only say this about sex and marriage. They don’t say it about friendships, working together, or any number of additional relationship dimensions family members might have with each other, or at least this objection is not enshrined in law, as it is with laws that deny marriage equality. It is as if these people think sex and marriage are bad things and about doing bad things to the other person(s). Are those who oppose equality frustrated? Are they doing sex wrong?

Many people have many relationships that have more than one aspect. Some women say their sister is their best friend. Why can’t their sister be a wife, too? When someone gets married, nobody from the government asks if this will ruin their friendship or their business, and it should not ask if it will ruin their fraternity, either.

Some people do also apply this to same-gender relationships. Friendships, these people say, become potential sexual relationships; it confuses relationships because men are supposed to be friends and not lovers, they say. If that is the limitation people want to place on themselves, they can. They should not be able to place such limits on other consenting adults.

When people are functioning socially in their biological roles, sex would create an additional bond. For some who are not functioning socially in those roles (as is often the case with Genetic Sexual Attraction), that bond may not exist in the first place and this is a way to form one. It should be up to them what kind of a relationship they're going to have.

People who are related through birth, adoption, or marriage (stepfamily) may or may not get along. They may be cruel towards each other or they can be best friends. The law can't force adults to love each other, regardless of their relation, and it shouldn't stop them from loving each other however they mutually agree.


There is no good reason to deny an adult, regardless of gender, sexual orientation, race or religion, the right to share love, sex, residence, and marriage (and any of those without the others) with any and all consenting adults without prosecution, bullying, or discrimination.

Feel free to share, copy and paste, and otherwise distribute. This has been adapted from this page at Full Marriage Equality: http://marriage-equality.blogspot.com/p/discredited-invalid-arguments.html

Go to NOT a Good Reason to Deny (Polyamorous) Love #16

Go to NOT a Good Reason to Deny (Consanguineous) Love #18 

National Sons Day

In the US, Saturday, September 28 is National Sons Day.

Celebrate sons. All sons, regardless of sexual orientation or relationships. 

Whether they are cis, trans, fluid, or whatever their identity, if they are sons, it is their day.

Are you a son?

Do you have a son? If you have a son, it's time to think about the good things he's brought into your life and what you can do to show your support and appreciation.

Are you celebrating?

Do tell in the comments below.

If you have something to share or ask you don’t want in the comments, you can write to Keith at fullmarriageequality at protonmail dot com

Falsely Invoking Science to Justify Bigotry

The "genetics argument" against consanguineous sex and marriage is usually a smokescreen that misuses science to justify bigotry.  There are some people sincerely concerned about children born to consanguineous parents (many of whom would have their concerns eased with a little education on the matter) but most of the people who use the "What about the children?" argument are simply trying to excuse their prejudice, because it sounds better than "I don't like the idea of it."

Ask someone who invokes Discredited Argument #18 if they drop opposition when it comes to a relationship that will not create biological children, such as two cisgender brothers, or a sister with a brother who has had a vasectomy, or siblings over the age of 60. Most will be stumped or will say no, they still oppose such relationships, perhaps citing another Discredited Argument, probably #1 or 3.

Another way of exposing this as a smokescreen is to ask them if they support the same restrictions on an unrelated heterosexual couple in which the woman is 40 years of age.

The fact is, we don't prevent people with known, serious genetic diseases, or who have lived all of their lives in the same neighborhood with pollutants known to cause birth defects, or who have taken medications known to cause birth defects from dating, having sex, marrying, having children, etc., so why deny rights to consanguineous lovers who are more likely to have healthy children together or won't be having children at all?

Everyone knows happy, healthy, intelligent, adorable children born to close relatives, whether they know it or not, and whether the children themselves know of their true biological ancestry or not. I can point to such people whose parents were close relatives. Should they have not been born?

Most children born to consanguineous parents are healthy. That's a fact. We don't hear about that much. Instead, "horror" stories are sensationalized... where a tyrannical patriarch or set of people isolated their family and abused children, engaging in deliberate inbreeding over generations. The problems resulting are often caused by the lack of prenatal care, lack of medical treatment, poor nutrition, physical abuse, substance abuse, poor hygiene, a polluted environment, etc. That's as far removed from what this blog is about (loving relationships between consenting adults) as possible. Cases like that do not justify denying consanguinamorous adults their right to be together in whatever way they want.

Bigotry and restrictions against consanguineous lovers predate a good understanding of genetics. It is just that people now misapply facts about genetics to cover for their dislike of the idea of consanguinamory.

National Daughters Day

As I post this, it’s still National Daughters Day (September 25) in the US.

Celebrate daughters. All daughters, regardless of sexual orientation or relationships. 

Whether they are cis, trans, fluid, or whatever their identity, if they are daughters, today is their day.

Are you a daughter?

Do you have a daughter?

Are you celebrating?

Do tell in the comments below.

If you have something to share or ask you don’t want in the comments, you can write to Keith at fullmarriageequality at protonmail dot com 

Frequently Asked Question: Is This Incest?

One frequently asked question is whether dating this person would be incest, or if doing this activity with a close relative is incest. The question is posed in different ways…

Is this incest?
Is it incest to date my in-law?
Is it incest to date my adopted sister?
Is it incest to date my adopted brother?
Is it incest to date my stepbrother?
Is it incest to date my stepsister?
Is it incest to date my uncle?
Is it incest to date my aunt?
Is it incest to date my cousin?
Is it incest to kiss my brother?
Is it incest to kiss my sister?
It it incest if my sibling and I have masturbated in front of each other?

The subtext is usually, “Is it wrong?”

First of all, regardless of laws, I see nothing wrong with any kind of physical affection, contact, or companionship between any consenting adults or minors who are close in age, as long as existing vows to others are not being violated. This includes dating, literally sleeping together, seeing each other nude, hand-holding, hugging, kissing (of any sort,) contact with genitals, intercourse, living together, marrying, etc. If these people are right for each other and want this with each other, then it shouldn’t be anyone else’s place to object.

As I always point out, I’m writing about consensual experimentation, exploration, affection, making out, sex, love, dating, partnering, living together, and marriage. I’m not talking about assault, molestation, abuse, or coercion. If someone forces themselves on you, that is wrong regardless of their relation to you.

What is incest? That depends on who you ask. The definition I once found at Wikipedia was…

Permission Granted

Dear Reader,

This is your permission slip. This is your license.

If you have had feelings or thoughts, maybe even some sexual contacts, that you’ve been told are wrong because you’re not supposed to be with…

• someone of a different or specific race 
• someone of the same gender
• someone of certain gender identities 
• someone of certain sexual orientations 
• more than one person
• someone older or younger than you
• someone who is a close relative or family member

… you are hereby granted permission to explore.

If both or all of you are:

1. able to consent
2. free to consent per the rules of whatever existing relationships you have that you want to keep intact
3. consenting

…you have permission.

It doesn’t matter if people who aren’t involved don’t like it.

Whether you don’t know if they’d consent yet, or you’ve already gotten together with them & are questioning it, or you’re somewhere between those places, know that…

• You’re not alone - many people have felt, thought, and done this and are feeling, thinking, and doing this 
• It’s not wrong to feel your feelings
• It’s not wrong to think your thoughts
• It’s not wrong for people to consent to share affection or play 
• What matters is consent 
• You’re more likely to regret not trying than respectfully and carefully trying 

We embrace love, affection, freedom, curiosity, experimentation, exploration, and shared experiences.

Contact Keith for further discussion.

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PERMISSION SLIP

The holder of this permission slip is hereby granted permission to fantasize about & otherwise consider and engage in sharing love, touch, sex, kink, relationships, partnerships, residence and more with any and all who consent, as they mutually agree.

Need Someone to Talk With?

Need someone to talk with?

You’re welcome to reach out to me. My name is Keith. Reach out to me with your questions, observations, experiences, or just to chat.

If you’re sexually experienced with a family member or close relative, or you want to be, or someone who is a family member or close relative might have expressed sexual interest in you, you can reach out to me.

If you think or know that someone you know is with a close relative or family member, and you have questions or concerns, you can reach out to me.

If you or someone you know has been reunited with, or introduced to, a close genetic relative and there is a serious feeling of attraction, you can reach out to me.

If you or someone you care about is in, pursuing, or curious about a nonmonogamous approach to relationships or dating (such as polyamory, open relationship, swinging, swapping, etc.), you can reach out to me.

If you are, or might be, LGBTQ+ and you need someone to talk with you don’t have to see at home, your workplace, or your school, you can reach out to me.

If  just need someone to “listen” to you, you can reach out to me.

I never share what someone tells me privately with anyone else unless you give me permission. Thousands of people have told me their secrets.

In addition…

Everyone willing to be respectful in a dialogue is welcome to reach out to me, but I’d also especially like to hear from:

-Media producers and journalists willing to take a neutral or positive approach to these topics.

-Therapists, counselors, psychologists, mental health professionals, and social workers who have a neutral or positive approach to these topics.

-Academics and researchers willing to take a neutral or positive approach to these topics.

-Lawyers, attorneys-at-law, etc., government officials, legislators, politicians, and activists willing to help support relationship rights and full marriage equality for all.

-Business owners whose businesses are safe spaces for all (especially lodging and dining establishments, travel or tourism businesses).

You can email fullmarriageequality at protonmail dot com, or reach out on Wire messaging app at fullmarriageequality (Wire is great, but if you must use a different messaging app, that might be possible.)

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/fullmarriageequality

X/Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/FullMEquality - You can send Direct Messages.

If a day or two goes by and you haven’t heard back from me, it likely means your message didn’t reach me.

Attention Mental Health and Relationship Professionals

If you're a professional (or on your way to becoming one) in the fields of mental health -or- counseling for romantic or sexual relationships, I'd like to hear from you, if any of the following apply to you:

1. You've personally felt attraction to, sexual desire for, or romantic feelings for, or have been curious about getting sexual with a close relative or family member, whether you raised, were raised by, or were raised with them or not. This could be what is described as incestuous desires, attractions or fantasies, or consanguinamorous feelings, or Genetic Attraction or Genetic Sexual Attraction.

2. You've personally experienced consanguinamory, or incestuous or consanguineous sex or experimentation with a close relative or family member, whether you raised, were raised by, or were raised with them or not. (Note: I'm not talking about assault, but rather experimentation, affection, or sex.)

3. You support (even if just quietly to yourself) the rights of consenting close relatives to be together in romantic or sexual relationships or have sexual experiences together.

4. Whether in your personal life (4a) or your professional life (4b), you've wanted to be an ally or affirming or welcoming of people with such experiences or feelings.

This is not a request for services.* We want to know of your mere existence at least; you can even stay anonymous. We know you're out there. I've been in contact with a few of you over the years. So please let us know you exist, and which of the above apply to you. You can be as simple as stating the number(s) above.

So if any of those apply to you, whether you are, or have been, or are on your way to becoming, a therapist, mental health or relationship counselor, a relationship coach, LMFT, MFCC, psychologist, psychiatrist, social worker, sociologist, or any other similar professional, credentialed or otherwise, it would be great to hear from you.

You can comment below, including anonymously (you can also request your comment not be published) and there are many other ways to reach out. I’d never publish anything you send to me without your permission.

You can email fullmarriageequality at protonmail dot com, or reach out on Wire messaging app at fullmarriageequality

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/fullmarriageequality

Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/FullMEquality - You can send Direct Messages.

*While this is not a request for services and you can remain completely anonymous if you'd like, you are welcome to provide as much information as you'd like (again, nothing gets published without your permission) and if you ARE willing to take on clients, that would be wonderful to know. Your feedback on the topics of this blog are welcome, too.

Quora Answer About Breaking the Ice

I’m continuing a series here of answers I posted to Quora that got attacked by censors. While most of my appeals have been granted, restoring my answers, the silly censors have continued to report my answers out of desperate bigotry. So, this could turn out to be a looooong series. Enjoy!

If you don’t follow me on Quora already, please do so and upvote my answers, if you’re so inclined. 

*****

https://www.quora.com/Me-and-my-mom-both-have-sexual-feelings-for-each-other-but-are-afraid-of-taking-this-ahead-How-do-I-deal-with-this/answer/Keith-Pullman

Me and my mom both have sexual feelings for each other but are afraid of taking this ahead. How do I deal with this?

Keith Pullman

I have interviewed hundreds of people about their families. 4y

Assuming you’re of age to consent, what you do is you make each other and yourselves as comfortable as possible, in a time and place you’re alone and not rushed, and you take things slowly. Hug, cuddle, kiss. Rub each other’s shoulders and legs.

You two can slowly intensify the kisses and move your touches to places you haven’t touched each other before. If either one of you wants to stop, stop. If you both want to go more slowly or more quickly, you can. You needn’t go any further than you both want.

*****

NOTE: These specific answers in this series were "deleted" at Quora after being there for a while and being well-received. They were probably hidden from view because some bigot targeted me, as evidenced by the fact that many were deleted in rapid fire.

I have previously appealed such deletions successfully. However, whether or not my deleted answers are restored, I’ll be adding them to this blog. You’ll see for yourself there’s no reason to delete these answers.

Talk It Over and Discuss the Possibilities

People come to this blog because they are having feelings or experiences that are often met with prejudice elsewhere, or they know someone who is having such feelings or experiences. If you're not sure your partner(s) would accept your feelings or fantasies, the information below might help. Maybe you can show this to them and see if they'll agree to discussions.

Clinical psychologist David J. Ley, Ph.D. wrote something very helpful at psychologytoday.com titled "3 Ways to Meet Your Partner’s Sexual Ideals and Why You Should"...

Viewing your partner’s sexual ideals and needs as important and valuable protects and enhances your relationship. Even if you can’t meet your partners’ sexual ideals, sexual communion mitigates the degree to which that mismatch negatively impacts your relationship.

Ley goes on to describe how to start to use this. Although Ley is writing about partners, this also might be helpful for people who are not yet partners, such as if there is someone who is in your life as a family member or friend but you want to add a sexual bond to your relationship.

Nonjudgmental Listening. The best, first, and most important way that partners can express sexual communion with each other is by communicating about their sexual likes and dislikes, in a manner that involves respect and acceptance. Acknowledging and valuing your partners’ sexual preferences is a critical and meaningful way to let them feel valued and accepted as a person, within your relationship. Have a conversation (actually, it’s best to have lots of little conversations as opposed to just one big one) with your partner about their sexual needs and experiences. Try to make them feel like you are interested and curious about their sexuality. Believe it or not, this is as valuable in long-term relationships with decades of history as it is in fresher relationships. Most people never tell anyone, even their life partners, about their sexual fantasies and interests, for fear of rejection and judgment.

Emphasis mine. Listening is so important. Getting your partner(s) to open up and share with you is the way to grow and deepen the relationship.

For Parents Considering Consanguinamory

One of the popular pages on this blog is this Courting Consanguinamory page, which has helped a lot of people. That page is generalized, though, about starting any consanguinamorous relationship. This entry below is adapted from an answer I gave on Quora, to a parent who was asking about starting a consanguinamorous bond with their adult daughter. Most of it is adaptable to those considering being with a son, too.

Contrary to myths, this not illegal everywhere. There are a couple of US states and many countries in which it is not illegal for an adult to have sex with their parent(s). Also, there are mentally healthy women who will confide that this was one of the best experiences of their lives. Even where still illegal, very few such relationships are ever brought to the attention of law enforcement, thankfully.

You’d need to be delicate about doing this, not clumsy or rushed. You don’t want to put any pressure on her nor upset her.

Do you know if she is attracted to people of your gender? Could she be attracted to, or sexual with, someone your age? These are things you can find out by talking with her without making it clear that you would like to add a sexual or romantic bond with her.

A Sister Gives Her Thoughts on Their New Life

Sometimes, after this blog publishes an interview, a partner of the interviewee or someone else connected to them wants to add some more from their perspective. This time, the lover of the man interviewed in this recent entry is adding her perspective. Read that interview or read it again, as it will be helpful for reading what this woman has to say below.

If you have any heart at all, you have to see how outrageous it is to deny this woman and her lover their rights.

*****

FULL MARRIAGE EQUALITY:  Did you want to add to how your brother described you?

Samaira: The only thing I can add to is that we have a never-give-up approach to life.


FME: What is your take on your childhood, family life, and discovering your sexuality?

Ethical Nonmonogamy is Not Cheating

Cheating is breaking an existing agreement or vow and keeping/intending to keep that breech of the agreement a secret from the person or people with whom it was made rather than informing the other(s) that the agreement is over (which is "leaving").

Ethical nonmonogamy is not cheating. (ENM may also be known as “consensual nonmonogamy” or “disclosed nonmonogamy.”)

For example, Mark and Jenny are swingers. Their agreement is that they will only be with others when they are both present. Anything more than a hug or kiss on the cheek with someone else, or revealing genitals to someone else in a social context, when they are not together, is a no. They attend parties together and have sex with others there; that's not cheating. But while Jenny is out of town on business, Mark picks up a woman at a bar and she gives him oral sex. Under the agreement he has with Jenny, this is cheating. Other swingers have different rules.

Some people have open relationships/marriages and a "don't ask, don't tell" policy, meaning the partners can be with others and won't ask or tell each other about who or what or when, often with certain conditions such as using protection and having STI tests. If you're not communicating with a potential partner's other partner(s), you can't be sure that being with you wouldn't involve your potential new partner cheating. Ultimately, though, at some point you just have to trust what someone tells you because establishing an absolute negative is extremely difficult. How can you be sure they don't have an agreement with some other person out there that would be breached with whatever you're doing? You can't. You can only be sure that you're not cheating on someone.*

Ethical nonmonogamy can take many forms, from lifelong spousal triads and quads (polyamory) to couples swapping to swinging to open marriages to couples engaging in the occasional casual threesome to someone living alone but having casual hookups. Informed consent is the core of all of this. While ENM is not cheating, people who profess or attempt to maintain ENM might cheat, just like monogamists might cheat. If there is a closed triad and someone in the triad has a secret lover on the side contrary to the agreement with the two others in the triad, that's cheating. "Fluid bonding" is a term used in polyamorous circles. Someone might only have unprotected sex with one person, and protected sex with others. Going without protection would be a form of cheating.

One should never assume that someone who is married or at least coupled isn't available, although one can certainly decide they don't want to be with someone who is married or coupled. That's each person's decision to make. Just because someone is married or has a partner doesn't automatically mean they aren't available for romance or sexual affection or some other social activities (meals together, going to the theatre).

While one may decide that kissing someone else is cheating and a deal breaker for their relationship, not all cheating has the same implications and risks.

Open Letter to the Accomplished and Famous: Come Out Consanguinamorous

We know you're there. You're generally famous or at least famous in your industry, mostly because you're highly accomplished. And... you're consanguinamorous or have experience with consanguinamory. Some of you need to come out.

You're a performance artist, whether an actor or singer or musician or model.

Or you're someone who's held executive positions in the biggest companies.

Or you're an academic.
Or you're a top athlete.
Or a high ranking member of the military.
Or a journalist or author with national stature.
Or... you have some other place in life.


Whatever the case, you've "made it." You have the admiration and respect of a lot of people.

But what hardly anyone knows about you is that you are enjoying, or have enjoyed, a special relationship with a close relative, or you might even be exclusively or primarily attracted to close relatives. Maybe you have an unrequited attraction; the other person knows about it, but the two of you have not become "double bonded."

You need to seriously consider coming out.