Helping Your Family Members With Parenting

Life isn't neat and tidy. 

Even though there has been much pressure to force people into a heteromonogamous, single-race (but not consanguineous!) marriages and parenting in "nuclear family" homes, the majority of families don't stay with that construct indefinitely. 

Some parents don't marry, some divorce, some are widowed, some remarry, sometimes three or four generations are in the home, sometimes sons or daughters don't leave home until well into adulthood, if at all, sometimes they leave and come back, sometimes aunts and uncles live in the home, sometimes it's a home of a polycule, sometimes it's a couple of gay men, sometimes a couple of lesbian women, and on and on and on. There are adoptive homes, foster homes, homes with renters, homes with friends who live there, a bunch of roommates, on and on the variations go.

The point of this is that there may be someone in your family who could use some help raising their children, for so many different reasons, and it may be helpful if you lived together.

Especially if there is no other parent involved, it could be helpful if you could be designated as another parent to the child or children. Things that might help can include:

1) Being listed as another parent on any official paperwork.
2) Officially adopting the child or children.
3) Being married to the other parent.

There are sociologists who insist that it is best for a child to have parents married to each other, living in the same home. If that is true, isn't that another reason we should have full marriage equality? If a woman finds raising her children with her sister, mother, father, or brother, or a man finds raising his children with those family members to be the best option, why should they be denied their right to marry, if that's what they want? A single mother, for example should be free to marry her sister or brother, and that other sibling should be able to adopt the children, if that's what is wanted. This should be the case whether the siblings have a sexual or romantic relationship or not.

Wouldn't that be what's best for the children, if the adults want that?

This is another example of why the denial of full marriage equality needs to end. We need full marriage equality now.

Statistically, a relationship between two siblings on good terms will have more stability than with potential stepparents from outside the family.

Are you helping to raise your nephews or nieces or grandchildren? Might it be helpful if you were allowed to marry their parent?

Valentine’s Day is a Saturday This Year

For those of you who’ve been thinking about getting something started with someone or trying to get something started with someone, this could be your chance.

This especially applies when the person you’re trying to get with is someone already a regular part of your personal life, as is the case with close relatives or family members.

Does that person or those people already have plans for Saturday, February 14? If not, maybe you should set something up for them?

Set a date. Dates can be at home. The restaurants and other venues will be busy; setting up a nice evening in can be just what is needed.

Much of what is here on this page applies. Ideally, you’d already be to point number 4. Start now if you haven’t started yet.

If they don’t have a date, tell them you’ll treat them to a nice evening. If you don’t know whether or not they have a date, ask them if they have plans.

This doesn’t need to be a big production. Set the scene; you want to be alone with them unless anyone else present will help make things happen. Make or buy their favorite foods and drinks. Get them a nice gift that more on the romantic or erotic side, depending. We want them to feel appreciated and desired.

Special occasions can be the best time to get something started or add a new bond. Sitting around fantasizing about it for the rest of your life, never taking action even though you’ve had opportunities or could have created opportunities, is not the way to go through life. It’s up to you.

Good luck!

Is Polyamory Just a Renamed Swinger Lifestyle or Open Marriage?

No. This is a common misconception.

Swinging, open marriage, and polyamory are all forms of ethical, disclosed, or consensual nonmonogamy, meaning none of them are cheating, but they aren’t the same thing as each other.

Swingers have casual sex at clubs, events, or parties, usually ones that are mainly there or being held for the swinging element. Couples (and triads, and...) who swing have agreed with each other to do so.

Polyamory involves having a dating, romantic, partner, or spousal relationship with more than one person in a way to which those involved have agreed. For example, three people might live together as partners with each other in a triad. Or, one person might have ongoing dating relationships with three different people, none of whom spend time with each other, but all three of them are aware and agreeable to the fact that the person they are dating is seeing other people, not for the purposes of “picking” one of them, but on a continuing basis. Each of them may or may not be seeing or living with other partners. Polyamory can take many different forms.

An open marriage or open relationship is a marriage or relationship that isn't closed to new partners. The people in the marriage or relationship have agreed that one, both, or all of them are open to finding new partners, whether separately or together, whether those partners are for casual sex (like with swinging, or hookups, or threesomes) or a spousal relationship (like with polyamory), or some other way.

People in an open marriage or open relationship might swing, or might be polyamorous, or might look for casual encounters that aren't part of swinging. But many polyamorous people are in closed relationships and aren't open to having new partners. Some swingers consider their marriage or relationship only open for swinging and not anything else; it's not a generally open relationship and neither or none of them are looking for anyone outside of the context of swinging.

So...

Swingers may or may not consider themselves polyamorous.
Polyamorous partners may or may not swing.
Swingers might be in an generally open relationship or only be "open" for swinging.
Polyamorous relationships can be open or closed.

Whether you know it or not, you know people who are in consensually nonmonogamous relationships. You know people who are, or have been, swingers. You know polyamorous people. You know people in open relationships. People of all walks of life find these forms of ethical nonmonogamy suit them and their relationships. Some of them are health care providers, firefighters, accountants, airline pilots, military personnel, engineers. lawyers, educators, clergy, or stay-at-home parents.

Nonmonogamous people shouldn't be discriminated against or denied their rights. Let people have the relationships to which they've mutually agreed.

Frequently Asked Question: Why Is Incest Illegal?

It shouldn’t be illegal anywhere, as you’ll see. As always, we note that we are talking about consensual incest (consanguinamory), such as between consenting adults, and between minors close in age. We are not talking about anything involving coercion or force or molestation. There are laws against rape, assault, and molestation, and they should remain. We are talking about consensual incest, consanguineous sex and marriage, and consanguinamory, whether initiated through Genetic Sexual Attraction or not.

Short answer: It isn’t illegal everywhere, but where it is, it is the lingering result of sex-police holdovers, superstition, prejudice, and legislative inertia.

Long answer:

Martin Luther King, Jr.

In the US, Monday is a holiday, Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. Day. He was a giant in the fight for civil rights.



Many decades after he was assassinated, the fight for civil rights continues.

History is on our side. All consenting adults will be free to exercise their rights to share love, sex, kink, residence, and marriage.

Are you like those who kept trying to keep some people second-class citizens, or are you like the people who marched with King?

This is how you can help.

When Someone You Love Wants To Love You More

You may have come to this blog because you think or know someone in your family or closely related to you is attracted to you, or has a crush on you, or wants to get romantic or sexual with you. You may have had a mix of reactions to this, whether you've been shocked, surprised, confused, amused, bemused, worried, flattered, aroused, creeped out, repulsed, nervous, or some combination of these. So what do you do when a relative has a crush or very strong attraction to you?


These Feelings Are Normal and More Common Than You Think

These feelings are not so rare. There’s not necessarily any reason to get them to a mental health professional because they have these feelings. They are especially common when you were not raised by one another or with each other, but even if you were raised together or by one another, it's not unheard of.


These Feelings Aren't Wrong

Their feelings are their own. It is OK for them to have their feelings, and they certainly aren't alone in having such feelings.

And your feelings are your own.


Their feelings do not require you to act one way or another, but doing nothing at all is probably the worst way to react.

If you're feeling the same as they are, or want to seriously consider adding this bond to your relationship, you might be better off going to this entry here.

But if you're somewhat unsure, ambivalent, wavering, or all the way over to the side of being fairly certain you want no part of such a situation, the rest of his entry is for you.


Initial Reaction

Unless you've been hoping for this moment, you should probably take some time to think it over, even if your initial internal reaction was "No!" If you've already reacted negatively to them, there's still a chance to smooth things over.


Are You Sure It is How They Feel?


As we like to say around here, thinking and knowing are two different things.

It’s pretty clear how they feel if they explicitly say that they want to get it on, or they made an unmistakable physical pass at you, or you’ve overheard them masturbating and saying your name, or you’ve discovered that they keep images of you that are sexy or explicit or are very suggestive, or the history/files on their smart phone, tablet, or computer reveals they’ve been thinking about how to get with you.

If you've got a vagina and you find that your underwear (especially used) keeps getting moved or disappears and reappears in their room, that’s a pretty strong signal on their part; there is only doubt if they are the same size as you, in which case there is a small chance they wanted to wear it (washed). If you find that your underwear/lingerie or toys keep getting moved or used, that’s a strong indicator. It is also something I advise against people doing, just FYI.

If they've left this very essay for you to find, then it should be clear.

If you have such clarity, You can skip down to the next section.

But if it hasn’t been that clear, there's a chance they're not making a play or inviting you to. They may not even want to act even if they do have feelings for you in that way.

If you only think they might be interested, it could be a misunderstanding or maybe you are misreading them (or even projecting your own latent feelings).

Flirting or behaviors that would look like flirting to the average observer ignorant of your relation might be an indication, but those things aren't definitive if not explicit or blunt.

Maybe you've found out that they like (or even create) porn or erotica with incestuous themes. This does not necessarily mean they are attracted to you and want to have sex with you and are hoping to have sex with you. It's a very popular genre. Some people enjoy such material or even have a fetish for it without actually wanting to be with their own family members. Porn is usually very different from reality, after all. On the other hand, it can be a sign of interest.

Hints, clues, or signs likely to indicate they're interested:

• They look for reasons to be around you, especially alone, without an apparent agenda. 
• They suggest or arrange for you two to do things that romantic couples might do, even if it they try to make it seem like an accident (such as getting the two of you in a hotel room with just one bed). 
• They have increased physical contact with you. 
• You catch them staring at you or giving you lingering looks. 
• They’ve started or increased discussions about sex with you, especially consanguineous sex and relationships, and especially if it involves “joking” about consanguinamory or something happening between the two of you. 
• They express jealousy or envy towards your (potential) dates or lovers. 
• The people they date or find most attractive have similarities to you in appearance, age, mannerisms, etc. They may even (try to) date your friends. 
• They’ve “accidentally,” or have had excuses to, come in to where you are changing clothes or showering/bathing or have tried to call you in when they are changing clothes or showering/bathing when it hasn’t been typical for you to be in those circumstances together. 
• They are dressing up more impressively than usual or in more revealing clothing around you for no apparent reason.
• They’ve started to invite you to tell them how they look or if something they’re wearing is appropriate. 
• They mention having a sexual dream that included you. Even if they play it off as funny or strange, they could be trying to see how you react.
  

None of these by themselves mean it is certain they are sexually attracted to you, but the more that you recognize them doing, the more likely they are.

If you're still unsure and you don't want to come right out and ask them because it could be embarrassing, you can give them a chance to speak plainly about their feelings for you by talking about the subject in general. If you talk about it in a way that indicates to them that it is safe for them to talk with you about it and they can tell you anything, then they’ll reveal if they do feel that way for you. Some ways of doing this would be to say that you had a dream that included them, or that you’d consider it flattering if someone in the family thought you were attractive. You can say things like, "Is there anything on your mind you're not telling me? You can tell me anything, and I mean anything." Or something like, "You know, I've been thinking about how rare it can be for people to find a very strong, special connection to each other, and it is shame that some people think there is anything wrong with consenting adults loving each other in any way they want." There are many things you could say that will give them the confidence to be vulnerable with you.


You're Positive They Want to Jump Your Bones

No matter what your feelings are, you need to make it clear what boundaries, if any, you need to be in place.

Again, if you think you want to go for it, whether you’ve been hoping they feel that way or you’re curious or want to explore or experiment, go ahead and see this.

If you need limits on what is going to happen, when, where, etc., then you need to discuss that with them, as you should for any romantic or sexual relationship you’d have with anyone. Maybe your limits include cuddling, maybe kissing, maybe simply being naked around each other, maybe masturbating in front of each other, or touching each other or various forms of sexual contact. Maybe you want to move more slowly than you have with others (although many people in these situations end up moving faster than they have with others, and often regret that they didn’t get together sooner.)

If you think there is no way you'd want to get any more physically affectionate or romantic than you already do with them, do you know why? Consider if you’re internalizing a senseless prejudice against something that could be very enjoyable for both or all of you and bring you closer together. It might be a good idea to tell the other person you need some time to think about things. Sometimes, people who are initially shocked or have a negative reaction, after thinking it over, realize they have a mutual interest. The thought that they want you might have caught you off-guard or shocked you. Take some time of think about it. This is someone who loves you and knows you. It had to take some courage on their part to be vulnerable with you if they volunteered to you how they feel.

While there is no good reason to have laws or taboos against such relationships, you may have a reason to not have such a relationship, at least with this person. After all, each person needs to decide for themselves that they’re going to do and with whom when it comes to physical contact and romantic activities.

If you're not going to further or continue sexual or romantic affection, it would be best to let them down easy, and you probably want to let them down easy, unless they’ve been coercive in their approach. Who likes to be rejected?

Some things you might want to say, depending on the situation:

• You’re flattered 
• You love them
• You’re not upset with them 
• You just can’t go there because your feelings for them, while loving and pleasant, are entirely non-romantic and/or non-sexual 
• You’re not open to a romantic or sexual relationship anyone right now (or anymore) 
• You’re committed to someone else/others and do not want to jeopardize that 
• You just can’t take the possible risks
  

Even if you already reacted in a way that wasn’t exactly letting them down easy, you can go back to them and tell them that you’re flattered, you’re sorry you reacted that way, but you were caught off guard, then tell them one or more of the statements above.

If you take the route of not “going there,” be sure to be mindful of what you’re doing around them because you do not want to tease them or give them false hope. It is tough enough for them to deal with the rejection; don’t add to the difficulty.

Also, they may be consanguinamorous as their orientation, and even if they aren't they might pursue a consanguinamorous relationship with someone else. Here's how to be an ally.

If you'd like to contact me to discuss these matters further, you can write me at fullmarriageequality at protonmail dot com

(Disclaimer: This entry assumes you live, or would move to, someplace where affection would not be a criminal matter.)


How To Pull Off Living With Your Consanguineous Lover

NOT a Good Reason to Deny Love #4

“My religion is against it.” If you don’t want an (adult) intergenerational, interracial, same-gender, polygamous, or consanguineous relationship or marriage, then don’t have one. But we should all have the freedoms of religion and association and in places like the US, we have separation of church and state, so this can’t be a justification for denying marriage equality or other relationships rights.

There is no good reason to deny an adult, regardless of gender, sexual orientation, race or religion, the right to share love, sex, residence, and marriage (or any of those without the others) with any and all consenting adults without prosecution, bullying, or discrimination.

Feel free to share, copy and paste, and otherwise distribute. This has been adapted from this page at Full Marriage Equality: http://marriage-equality.blogspot.com/p/discredited-invalid-arguments.html

Go to NOT a Good Reason to Deny Love #3

Go to NOT a Good Reason to Deny Love #5 

A Cruel Double Standard

I've considered adding another entry to the Discredited Arguments page, because I've heard and read people say that people in consanguinamorous relationships (or step or adoptive relationships that have gone romantic) don't need the freedom to marry because they're already family. In addition to being as senseless as telling a woman she can't marry her sister's husband's brother (which is legal and does happen) because they are already family, the statement can bring up a very cruel double standard.

In many situations involving Genetic Sexual Attraction, the lovers are not legally family for the purposes of insurance, benefits, taxes, hospital visitation, next of kin, etc. because they were adopted into or born into (via sperm, egg, or embryo donation) different families. Also, in many places, when a married woman gives birth, the child is legally her spouse's child as well. What if, due to sex with someone other than her spouse, the woman's child is genetically a half-sibling to another married couple's child, and as adults they decide they'd like to marry?

The double standard is that, while these genetically related people don't enjoy the benefits of being family, in places that still have ridiculous laws discriminating against consensual adult incest, they are considered family and thus can (and are) criminally prosecuted for consensual sex or at least denied their right to marry.

You're not family so you can't get the benefit of being family. You are family so you are going to be prosecuted for having loved each other in sexual way. That's cruel.

As an example, if something were to happen to Melissa and she ended up in a hospital, her adoptive parents could bar Matthew and Linda from even being by her side, let alone making decisions about her care, even though Matthew and Linda are, for practical purposes, her spouses. She would be married to them if she could, but the law isn't there yet.

Those who are sharing, or want to share their lives as spouses or partners often do need the same rights, benefits, and protections as any other spouses, and there’s no good reason to deny them their fundamental right to marry. Also, marriage automatically provides for next-of-kin status, which is especially important when there is some discord between at least one of the lovers and legal family members outside of the consanguinamorous relationship.

There are many cruel double standards when trying to tell other consenting adults how to love each other. GSA or not, consanguinamorous people need discriminatory laws to be done away with, and need access to the protections provided by marriage, if they want them. This is yet another reason we need full marriage equality sooner rather than later.

When Middle-Aged Siblings Get Together

[Bumping this up]

Some people find this blog from doing a search. Today's interesting search phrase is...

Causes of middle age sibling incest

I'm assuming this is about sex, which is consensual, rather than assault.

I've largely explained the "causes" in this posting, which was about a father and adult daughter.

I have no way of knowing if the person doing the search is such a lover, has a partner who is involved, is a family member or friend, or someone else.

What I do know is that sex between siblings is common enough that everyone knows someone who is, or has been involved.

Since the previous posting I linked was about an adult and their parent, I'll add a few comments here specifically dealing with siblings.

For some middle-aged siblings, the origin of their sexual interaction goes back to having sexual contact as teenagers, which could have stopped for many reasons, including someone else intervening and stopping it, fear of persecution, the siblings finding other partners, going their separate ways for education and employment, and other reasons. Others have their first sexual contact with each other as middle-aged adults.

Having sex with each other in middle age, whether it is new or a resuming of past experiences, could be prompted by a variety of factors. Whether bored or dissatisfied in their relationships with others (and looking for a "safe" person to cheat with); looking to traverse what is, for them, new sexual territory whether they are single or in an open relationship; nostalgic for the past; looking for a "safe" partner who loves them after a breakup or divorce; brought into each other's presence and comforting each other after the death of a parent (or sibling or friend); one caring for the other through recovery from an injury or illness; just plain ol' curiosity or horniness combined with availability. Sometimes it is the first time the siblings have really been in each other's lives at all, and they feel a powerful attraction.

What causes these relationships isn't as important as respecting adults and their relationship and sexual rights. If they aren't cheating by sneaking behind a partner's back, violating an existing agreement, then siblings loving each other this way, especially as middle-aged adults, shouldn't be a matter for law enforcement nor finger-waggers. They are people who at least somewhat share a background, and are likely close in age, and the love each other. Be happy for them!

See:

Ten Myths About Sibling Consanguinamory

Interviews with Siblings in Sexual Relationships

Making a Move During the Holidays

Have you been waiting to make a move?

Is there someone you’ve wanted so badly to kiss? (And maybe do much more with?)

Christmas time might be the right time! People are feeling festive, and being around or under mistletoe is a great way to start kissing someone (with their consent).

If Christmas doesn’t work for that, there’s no better time to do it than the stroke of the New Year, when midnight hits and 2025 becomes 2026.

Of course, this assumes they’d welcome a kiss, and it requires you actually be the same place as them.

If neither of you are problem drinkers, some bubbly might help and be appropriate. Maybe some leftover mistletoe?

Keep things pleasant and fun as midnight approaches.

Then, when everyone’s excited, take your chance when you can.

Kissing at the turn of the year or the moments just after is common even between people who’ve never kissed before: people who are already in relationships, friends, family. This could be your chance!

You can reach out or comment below to share your New Years plans, experiences, and memories.

Cautious Consanguinamory 

Step 4 and the rest this page might help:

https://marriage-equality.blogspot.com/p/blog-page.html

Reach out to Keith to privately discuss the topics in this essay more. He can be emailed at fullmarriageequality at protonmail dot com, sent a message on Wire messaging app at fullmarriageequality, messaged on Bluesky at @marriage-equality, and X at @FullMEquality.

A Cautionary Tale of Polyamorous Consanguinamory

This wont be an easy or quick read. [Note: This was originally published several years ago. I’m bumping it up because it’s tied to this season. I’d very much like to publish an update on this family.]

This is an in-depth recounting from a woman who was in a polyamorous consanguinamorous triad of her own initiation. It has been several years since it ended.

It’s a cautionary tale, though, unlike most of the interviews you'll find here, because they didn’t ever *talk* about it. They never discussed anything about it. They just did it. That, along with feeling isolated because of societal negativity, made things stressful for this woman.

Communication is important in any relationship. It is especially important in polyamorous relationships, and especially polyamorous relationships that were already established before they became sexual. It’s vital when three or more people are involved. If you can’t communicate about what's going on, you shouldn’t really be attempting an ongoing relationship. Consanguineous sex is almost always explosive. The intensity is unlike anything else. There’s a reason we call it double love or a double bond. Some people liken it to an addictive drug, and this woman does, too.

Communication is important. Reaching out to others is important. Reading the whole account will take a while. As you read this, notice how things could have turned out differently if they had talked things through, and didn’t have to hide.

I present her experience in her own words below. I have organized what she told me, but these are her words. If you contact me about her, refer to her as Zoe.

PLEASE NOTE THAT SOME OF THE NARRATIVE BELOW RECOUNTS EXPLICITLY SEXUAL SITUATIONS.


*****

I’m a mid-to-late twenties female and I was in an extended sexual relationship with both parents. For a long time I've felt really isolated, and if there's someone out there that can read what happened to me and say, "Yeah, I feel that too," that's a good thing. It started when I was 18 and ended when I was 22.

Why Do I Feel This Way?

Has anything like these ever happened to you?

• You wake from from an erotically charged dream, feeling strange or confused because it featured a close relative or family member.
  
  
• You're close to orgasm, whether you're alone or with at least one other person, and thoughts of a relative pop into your head, taking you to climax.
  
  
• You've found yourself admiring your relative "a little too much," whatever the setting or occasion.

If you have experienced anything like any of those, you're not alone. This is more common than many people think, because far more people have such thoughts than will admit to most people they know.

If we're talking about someone who recently came (back) into your life and you were essentially raised through childhood apart, then it could be reunion GSA, which is very common in such situations. See this page for more information. Most of this entry also applies to you, but is more focused on people who were always in each other's life, or for the most part have been.

Is It Normal?