Consanguinamory and Reproduction

One of the most common reasons given to object to the right to consanguineous relationships is what I call the "mutant baby" argument. Even some people who support the right to consanguinamory and have even engaged in consanguineous sex themselves join with bigots in being strongly against close relatives having children together because of prejudiced backlash or the increased risk of birth defects.

In regards to the prejudiced backlash, the answer is not to let bigots have their way. It is for bigots to lose their power to bully, prosecute, and break up homes. Don't want children of consanguineous parents to have a hard time? Do not give them a hard time.

In regards to the increased risk of birth defects, scientific understanding is often lacking.

Most sexual encounters do not result in a birth. Many people who have relationships or marry never have genetic children together; some people in consanguinamorous relationships choose not to. So, we must recognize the differences between sex, marriage, parenting, and reproduction, and not ban the first three because of concerns about the last one.

But let's deal with that last one.

Most births to consanguineous parents do not produce children with significant birth defects or other genetic problems; while births to other parents do sometimes have birth defects. There are happy, healthy, bright, attractive people born to close relatives who are productive members of society. We all know some, whether we know it or not, and whether they know it or not. It is that common. (Sometimes, they were conceived by an abuser, but often, not by an abuser but by mutual lovers.) We don’t prevent other people from marrying or deny them their reproductive rights based on increased odds of passing along a genetic problem or inherited disease. For example, it is entirely legal in the US and most other places for someone with Huntington's Disease to date, have sex, marry, and have genetic children. How can such rights be denied to people who are genetically healthy, simply because they are close relatives?

It is true that in general, children born to consanguineous parents have an increased chance of genetic problems than those born to nonconsanguineous parents, but the odds are still minimal. (UPDATE: Please see this wonky elaboration written by a Friend of FME.) There are US states and there are countries where consanguinamory is not illegal or at least it isn't prosecuted. Sweden will legally marry half-siblings in some circumstances. A comparison of the rate of genetic problems in these places to places that criminalize and actively prosecute consanguinamory reveals no discernible increase in genetic problems in the places that embrace this relationship right.

If a natural talent or gift runs in the family, the children born to consanguineous parents will be more likely to inherit and manifest that beneficial result as well; a birth benefit. But there are increased odds of problem with births to older parents, too. There's no stigma assigned to that, and it isn't illegal for older people to date, have sex, marry, and have genetic children together.

Anyone concerned about these things should have genetic testing and counseling. People who are not close relatives can pass along health problems, too.

The "birth defects" argument also implies that people with disabilities or some other birth defect are living lives so terrible that they should never have been born at all. Yet, there are many such people who are leading happy, fulfilling, productive lives.

But a current problem, in some (not all) cases, is that in giving birth, consanguineous parents will be outing themselves to someone who is prejudiced, and there will now be evidence of their (in some places) illegal love that can be used against them.

There are consanguinamorous parents happily raising their healthy children together. But some consanguinamorous relationships face very real threats. Again, the answer is to stop the persecution and prosecution. There is no good reason to deny consenting adults their equal protection of having their relationship and reproductive rights.

Consanguinamorous or not, anyone engaging in heterosexual intercourse should be aware of the possibility of pregnancy, the various forms of birth control and other options available, and the realities if pregnancy, birth, and raising children.

UPDATE: Jane has a great essay on these topics here.

With all of that in mind, let's look at this thread on a consensual incest discussion board. (The discussion is explicit, so if you have a problem with that, you are warned.)

carebear82 wrote…

Veterans Day

November 11 is usually the Veterans Day holiday in the US.

I can’t help but think of the people who risked their lives (and those who gave them) and endured so many things in service to their country, who weren’t and haven’t been free to be who they really are and share their lives openly with the person or persons they love.

Recent years have brought progress, and we have to fight to keep what we've gained while still looking for more progress. Problematic laws and policies remain, and, of course, LGBTQ+ people, the nonmonogamous and polyamorous, and consanguinamorous still endure the the threat of prosecution, persecution, or discrimination.

Shouldn’t someone who risked their life for this country be able to marry more than one person, or a biological relative? Or at least share a life with the person(s) they love without a fear that their own government will be against them? Is bravery and valor negated if a man loves more than one woman, or his long lost sister? Shouldn’t a woman who served be free to marry both of the women she loves?

Let’s thank our veterans, some of whom were drafted into service, especially those who are still being treated as second class citizens.

Myth: I Don’t Know Anyone Who Has Experienced GSA

Reality: You might not know of them experiencing Genetic Sexual Attraction, but chances are, there is someone in your life who has experienced GSA.

Think it through. Someone experiences reunion GSA in up to 50% of all introductions/reunions of close genetic relatives who were not raised together or by one another, provided the genders and sexual orientations are compatible. Think of all of the people in your extended family and circle of friends, your classmates, coworkers, neighbors, fellow members of clubs or religious congregations, and the people who regularly provide you with a service or are a regular customer of yours. You might not know it in every case, especially since people might want to keep these things private, but a few of them are adopted or gave a child up for adoption, a few were conceived by sperm or egg donation or provided sperm or egg donations, a few were separated from a parent (and often half siblings) due to divorce or breakup or the relationship being a fling, one night stand, or affair. So some of them have had a genetic parent, child, sibling, aunt, uncle, nephew, or niece from whom they were separated enough that if, and when, they were introduced or reunited post-puberty, someone experienced GSA.

Just because one person experiences GSA doesn’t mean it is reciprocal. Even if reciprocated, it might not lead to consanguinamory. Even if it leads to consanguinamory, you might not find out about it.

There are certainly famous people you know of, perhaps even admire, who have experienced GSA.

The mobility of human beings has increased dramatically with transportation innovations, systems, and affordability. Gamete and embryo donations have become an increasingly common reality. Those things have meant more people maturing separated from close genetic relatives. Social networking is bringing people together, as is the same increased mobility that had them apart. These things mean more people experiencing GSA.

Since GSA almost always involves some pain (even if only due to external prejudice), people who experience it need compassion, not condemnation.

If you know or think it is possible that someone specific in your life has dealt with GSA, this might be of some help.

Even if you don't personally know anyone who has experienced GSA, shouldn't all adults have their rights when it comes to their relationships?

See Myth: People in GSA Relationships Don’t Need the Freedom to Marry

How Parents of Dating Siblings Can Help

Someone asked about this at this blog’s sister Tumblr [which no longer exists]. Since that post isn't available right now, I've added it here.

1. First and foremost, never out them to anyone against their will. There’s deadly bigotry against the consanguinamorous.

2. ASK them how you can be supportive. Everyone is different, after all. They might need you to help with their cover stories. They might want you to refer to them only by their first names, not as your son or daughter, in front of certain people. Maybe they need you to run interference between them and others in the extended family.

3. If you find what they’re doing “icky,” don’t say that to them. Think about it. Would you want someone else telling you that YOUR love life is icky?

4. If you’re willing to listen to them talk about their relationship, let them know that. Consanguinamorous people often feel alone and like they have nobody to talk with honestly about their love. However, make it clear you’re not going to pick sides if they quarrel.

5. Especially if they’re younger and depending on where you live, they might need your help in obtaining contraception.

6. If they need privacy for a date, give it to them. That might be letting them date at your place, even if they don’t live there, while you’re making yourself scarce.

7. If they don’t know that you know, signal your willingness to be supportive. There are multiple ways to do that, including discussing the topic of “forbidden” relationships in general, and letting them know you think it’s OK for siblings to date. Give them a safe setting in which to come out to you. If they don’t take the bait, don’t push it.

Check this out for more.

Full Marriage Equality is a Human Right

A friend pointed this out to me. From the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, Article 16…

Men and women of full age, without any limitation due to race, nationality or religion, have the right to marry and to found a family. They are entitled to equal rights as to marriage, during marriage and at its dissolution.

Marriage shall be entered into only with the free and full consent of the intending spouses.

Notice that it does not limit how many people may be married, or their genders, or their relations or lack thereof. The Declaration is compatible with full marriage equality.

Every nation should adopt full marriage equality, so that an adult is free to marry any and all consenting adults.

On Comments

Leo asked, “Why has the activity of commentators on this blog become noticeably lower this decade than in the 2010s?”

Good question.

We can only guess.

Traffic is generally up. There are many people visiting.

My guess is that more people would rather comment via emails, messaging, social media, etc. More people access this and other online content through smart phones and tablets, rather than laptops and desktops, and are less likely to see how to comment and to actually do so. I know I find it easier to write comments when I’m sitting, with a full sized keyboard, on a laptop. Fewer people visit like that now.

As a reminder, people can leave comments. They’ll need to be approved to be published, so as to prevent bad actors from posting.

And thanks to Leo for frequently writing thoughtful and encouraging comments. Do check the comments for his contributions.

Please Take Note

Whether or not you’ve ever reached out to me, Keith, even if you’re not planning to reach out, make a point of keeping my contact info and other places to find my content.

Keith on Quora 

Keith on Reddit 

Keith on X

Keith on BlueSky

Keith on Facebook

Reach out to me privately via email at fullmarriageequality at protonmail dot com, message me on Wire messaging app at fullmarriageequality.

I keep your privacy; I never share what someone has told me privately with anyone else unless you give me permission. I tend to respond to emails and private/direct messages within a day or two, so if I don’t, maybe it didn’t reach me.

Happy Halloween!

Halloween is October 31 and it is celebrated widely and diversely here in the US, with some events happening in the weeks before.

Do you have any special plans for Halloween? Have you done or will you do anything fun or interesting this year at a Halloween party or event?

Whatever you do, please be careful and stay safe!

Here in the states, the stores depend on Halloween to sell a lot of merchandise. In typical years, there are parties, costume contests, what amounts to theatre in front of (and inside, sometimes) the homes of people as they try to scare or entertain neighbors and strangers with things ranging from silly to sexy, spooky to gory. In some places, kids (and often parents) in costumes go from door to door collecting candy or other treats.

Many amusement parks, ranging from small to the largest, do special entertainment in the weeks leading up to Halloween, and this is a favorite time of the year for movie studios to release horror movies, and for streamers and broadcasters to show ones from years past.

For some, there are religious or spiritual aspects to the day, and it might be called by other names.

Some interesting things can happen when people are having fun at costume parties, or cuddled up together watching scary movies. Maybe you'll be home with family or other loved ones, watching something good or playing some fun games?

So, as always, feel free to comment or share your plans or stories, including from years past. You can comment anonymously below.

If you think you might want to make your move to add a bond with one or more people, and you need to talk with someone about it, consider reaching out Keith via email at fullmarriageequality at protonmail dot com or on the Wire messaging app at fullmarriageequality.

Yes, We Support Consanguinamory

As this blog supports the rights of ALL who can consent to share love, sex, kink, residence, partnership, and marriage as they mutually agree, that necessarily includes consanguineous relationships, also known as consanguinamory, intrafamilial sexuality and romance, or consensual incest. This includes supporting people experiencing Genetic Sexual Attraction whether they are sexually affectionate or not. 

The "i" word often gets very strong reactions, but it is wrong to conflate abuse, assault, or molestation with romance, affection, or recreational sex between consenting people. That's one reason we prefer to use the term consanguinamorous or consanguinamory.

These relationships exist between close relatives who first meet well into adulthood as well as those who were raised with each other. They include "family with benefits" relationships and fully rounded romances. They can be youthful experimentation, golden years fun, short flings, lifelong spousal relationships, or everything between. They can be closed, monogamous pairings, open relationships, polyamorous, or otherwise nonmonogamous.

They also happen all over the planet and always have, regardless of race, class, educational status, or rural or urban settings. They are common enough that you know people who are having, or have had, such experiences, maybe even people you admire very much.

We fully support such affection.

We don't apologize for that.

We hope you do or will do the same.

We are here to help people who are in, have been in, or want to be in such relationships. We support their rights and aim to assist them in their relationships.

Yes, some people are disgusted by the very thought. That's fine. They don't have to be involved in these relationships. But they shouldn't be able to interfere in the relationships of others.

If you, or someone you know, has had such experiences, or you have questions or comments, you're always welcome to contact Keith via email at fullmarriageequality at protonmail dot com and via Wire messenger at fullmarriageequality. You can also comment below (including anonymously). There is also a place to get in contact with others.

Here are other entries that might be of some help.

Interviews With the Consanguinamorous

Why Is Consanguinamory Illegal In Many Places?

Why Do I Feel This Way?

When Someone You Love Wants to Love You More

Should You Do It?

Sometimes The Ice Just Needs Breaking

For Parents Considering Consanguinamory

You Did the Taboo - Now What?

Consaguinamory and Reproduction

Coping With Being Outed as Consanguinamorous

Coming Out Consanguinamorous

How To Be An Ally to Consanguinamorous People You Know

Myth: People in GSA Relationships Don’t Need the Freedom to Marry

Reality: Some people in Genetic Sexual Attraction relationships need and want the freedom to marry, and there is no good reason for them to be denied their right to marry if they’re consenting adults.

Because people experiencing GSA are close genetic relatives, some people argue that they don’t need their right to marry because they’re already family. However, they might not be considered family under the law, although in a loathsome double-standard, they may still be subject to discriminatory laws based on their genetic relation.

Those who are already sharing their lives as spouses, or want to, often do need the same rights, benefits, and protections as any other spouses. Also, marriage automatically provides for next-of-kin status, which is especially important when there is some discord between the lovers and others who are legally recognized as family. For example, if brothers Adam and Steve have been living as spouses for years and Steve winds up in a coma in the hospital, Steve’s estranged, bigoted, adoptive parents would likely be able to usurp Adam’s rights to make decisions.

An adult should be free to marry any and all consenting adults.

See Myth: Acting on GSA Needs to be Criminalized, Prosecuted, and Stopped

See Myth: I Don’t Know Anyone Who Has Experienced GSA

NOT a Good Reason to Deny (Polyamorous) Love #10

“Polyamory/polygamy spreads sexually transmitted infections.” Unprotected sex with someone who is infected is how such infections may be transmitted. Twenty people could have group sex and a group marriage for fifty years and if none of them brings an infection into the marriage and they only have sex with each other, none of them will get a sexually transmitted infection.

We do not deny people their freedom to marry based on which diseases they have. In most places, people can legally have sex with multiple partners anyway. Polyfidelity can be encouraged if polygamy is legalized and polyamory is no longer stigmatized, which would actually reduce disease transmission. Polyamorous people tend to be more careful about prevention, safer sex, and actually talking about the issues involved.

There is no good reason to deny an adult, regardless of gender, sexual orientation, race or religion, the right to share love, sex, residence, and marriage (or any of those without the others) with any and all consenting adults without prosecution, bullying, or discrimination.

Feel free to share, copy and paste, and otherwise distribute. This has been adapted from this page at Full Marriage Equality: http://marriage-equality.blogspot.com/p/discredited-invalid-arguments.html

Go to NOT a Good Reason to Deny Love #9 

Go to NOT a Good Reason to Deny (Polyamorous) Love #11

Spirit Day 2026

Thursday, October 15 is Spirit Day. Among varying activities, people wear purple in support of LGBTQ+ youth, against bullying.

Nobody should be bullied, harassed, or discriminated against because of their gender, sexuality, or relationship diversities or those of their family members or friends.

Are you observing Spirit Day? Leave a comment below telling us about it.

Defend people against prejudice, bullying, harassment, and discrimination. You can make a difference!

How You Can Help

First and Only

We have another exclusive interview to bring you.

People in consanguinamorous relationships are everywhere, though consanguinamorists tend to be closeted. Fortunately, some are willing to be interviewed for this blog. As a result, Full Marriage Equality has featured scores of exclusive interviews with lovers denied the freedom to marry and have that marriage treated equally under the law. Most can’t even be out of the closet or they’ll face persecution and prosecution under absurd incest laws, which, instead of focusing on abuse, also target consensual relationships.

The man and woman interviewed below should be free to legally and publicly marry, or simply be with each other without having to hide, yet they can’t. Prejudice can be deadly. They are consenting adults; why should they be denied their rights? In much of the world, including where they live, they could be criminally prosecuted for loving each other this way, and might be persecuted severely in addition.

Read the interview below and see for yourself what they have to say about the love they share. You may think this relationship is interesting, or it might make you uncomfortable, or you might find it ideal, even highly erotic, but whatever your reaction, should lovers like these be denied equal access to marriage or any other rights simply because they love each other this way?

Also please note that someone you love, respect, and admire could be in a similar relationship right now. Should they be attacked and denied rights because of the "incest" label?

NOTE: This interview includes brief descriptions of lovemaking between teens, who, where they lived, could legally consent to sex with strangers at their ages.

*****

FULL MARRIAGE EQUALITY: Describe yourselves.

David: Hello everyone. I’m David, 30, male, and currently residing in Salt Lake City, Utah with my sister/wife and our daughter. I’m a six-foot one-inch white male with a lean, muscular body. I graduated in finance and am currently working as a Financial Advisor for a bank.

We both come from a strong socioeconomic background as our dad inherited a lot of land and owned multiple businesses throughout his life, but we are proud to say everything we own is from our own hard work. Having said that, our parents are also really conservative Mormons. We come from a family where dating and sex before marriage are still a taboo so you can say we absolutely obliterated their values [laughs]. 

We both are big on fitness and go to the gym religiously. Some of my hobbies include gaming, kayaking during summer, and skiing during winter. I love remodeling around the house and always finding projects to work on. A few things I have done over the past three or four years, since we bought our house, was to put a wooden fence around the house myself, remodeled the living room by adding custom shelves, ceiling lights, paint and much more. 

We do not have any other siblings.

Sarah: Hello everyone, I’m Sarah, 32, female, and I’m the sister/wife to David and mom to our beautiful daughter. I have long and silky blonde hair going down to my lower back, and all natural. I’m a slim, curvy girl with a big bust - got it from my mom. I graduated dental school and did my specializations in orthodontics, however, currently I’m a stay-at-home mom looking after our daughter. I do plan to start working again in a few months, but no rush to be honest.

Like David mentioned, we are gym freaks and love working out. I don’t have a lot of hobbies like David, but I do enjoy playing Call of Duty, Battlefield, Halo and FC26. 

Coming Out Day 2026

Life can be tough for someone whose identity and orientation doesn’t fit in to a narrow little heterosexual, monogamous, "traditional"-gender-role box or whose relationship doesn’t meet the local sex police’s approved standards. Sometimes, a person or the people in a relationship want to come out of the closet. Sometimes they need to come out. For some of these people, it is a little less difficult if they do so as part of a communal event, such as National Coming Out Day.

National Coming Out Day is TODAY, October 11. Here’s the official website, at least for the US. There is much helpful information there, regardless of where you live.

The more people that come out, the more the others around them will realize they do know and appreciate people who are LGBTQ+, or polyamorous or otherwise nonmonogamous, or consanguinamorous, and that such people and relationships deserve equality. So coming out helps progress.

On the other hand, it is understandable that any given person, couple, triad, or quad decides to stay in the closet for now. There’s still so much hate, so much prejudice and persecution, and even unjust laws that hinder the life and love of people who are good citizens and just want to be themselves. I support the decision of anyone who believes they need to be reserved for now for the sake of their safety and family.

The decision to come out is yours. Do you want to come out, and to whom? Your friends? Your family? Your coworkers? Your classmates? Your neighbors? Your crush? The whole world?

Also, if someone comes out to you, the decision to be an ally is yours. If your classmate, coworker, neighbor, friend, parent, child, or sibling comes to you and says they are gay, lesbian, bisexual, polysexual, pansexual, transgender, non-binary, genderfluid, polyamorous, nonmonogamous, consanguinamorous or in a consanguinamorous relationship, what will you do? Will you choose love and acceptance?

Even if you are heterosexual, monogamous, and nonconsanguinamorous, you may want to come out as an ally for full marriage equality. That alone can take courage, but it helps.

If you are planning to come out, or you do come out, please feel free to share your experience here by commenting. You can do so anonymously. You are also welcome to contact Keith if you want someone to talk with. The best ways to do that are to email fullmarriageequality at protonmail dot com or message fullmarriageequality on the Wire messaging app.

What Is Cheating?

Cheating is breaking the rules.

In a relationship, the rules are set by the people in the relationship.

As such, for some, having sex with other people is NOT cheating. If the rules of their relationship allow for having sex with other people under certain conditions, and those conditions are met, then it isn't cheating.

Also, relationships can and do have rules other than "don't have sex with other people" or "only have sex with other people under these conditions." Those rules can be almost anything to which the people in the relationship have agreed, including "Don't spend more than this amount of money on something without discussing it with me first." That's a very common rule for people who have combined their finances.

Another rule that can apply to sex is "We will share sexual affection on a regular basis, as long as extraordinary circumstances don't prevent us." Thus, cheating can include one partner consistently rejecting the other partner, cheating that partner out of something to which was agreed.

While there are common basics that should be discussed with every (potential) partner, it's difficult to discuss every possible hypothetical nuance and variation and agree to rules about each, and so being flexible about adding, removing, or modifying rules can be helpful, especially since people discover more about themselves, what they have to offer, and what the need as they age and grow. Keep in mind that most people have a tendency to have expectations and desires, and make assumptions, that go unstated, and someone can still damage trust and their relationships with the partner(s) without technically cheating. So, please, state upfront some of the basics and work from there. These might be "I am mostly monogamous and need my partner to be mostly monogamous" or "I'm ethically nonmonogamous" or "I am polyamorous" and go from there, detailing what is meant. 

Strict monogamy shouldn't be expected by default; it must be something that is discussed, with an agreement being made. None of us can assume that someone we are interested in is "available" because they're not in a relationship, or that they are "unavailable" because they are in a relationship. That is something to discuss with them.

Lesbians Day 2026

Thursday, October 8 is International Lesbians Day.

Today and every day, it is good to remember that, like anyone else, lesbians should be free to share love, sex, kink, residence, and marriage (and any of those without the others) with any and all consenting partners. 

Lesbians should be free to live their lives, without fear of harassment, bullying, criminalization, or discrimination.

Thank you to all of our lesbian friends and allies!

Respect For Marriage Act

Like many countries, the US needs a national "Respect For Marriage Act."

Our laws should ensure that an adult is free to marry any and all consenting adults, and have their marriages respected under the law, in courts, by schools, in hospitals, by insurance agencies, and so forth. This should be the case in every state, county, and city.

Ideally, we would adopt a Marriage Equality Amendment that supports diversity, equity, and inclusion.

There is no good reason to deny an adult, who is capable of consent, regardless of their age, race, ethnicity, national origin, religion, gender, sexual orientation, or any other personal characteristic, their rights to consent to relationships, love, sex, kink, residence, or marriage with any and all consenting adults.

Denying the polyamorous right to marry shouldn’t be part of any law. Equality “just for some” isn’t equality.

Let's support full marriage equality.

It’s Always Good to Hear From You

There is one of me here (and a few other people who do similar work elsewhere), and I’m doing this for free, and have to squeeze it in around the rest of my life. There are millions of you, thousands of whom have contacted me over the years. That means it’s difficult for me to keep in contact unless you keep reaching out. 

I always like hearing from people who are or have been lovers, the curious, the allies, questioning friends and family, and anyone who isn’t a closed-minded bigoted hater.

Whether you’ve been in contact with me (Keith) before or not, please feel free to reach out, even just to say hello.

Reach out to me privately via email at fullmarriageequality at protonmail dot com, message me on Wire messaging app at fullmarriageequality, message me on Bluesky at @marriage-equality, and X at @FullMEquality.

For Consanguinamorists Considering Parenting

I was asked anonymously on Tumblr about the health of children from consanguineous parents, why there is a taboo about this, and what advice I have for a mother and son having a baby.  My answers mostly apply to any consanguinamorous parents.

National Sons Day

In the US, Monday, September 28 is National Sons Day.

Celebrate sons. All sons, regardless of sexual orientation or relationships. 

Whether they are cis, trans, fluid, or whatever their identity, if they are sons, it is their day.

Are you a son?

Do you have a son? If you have a son, it's time to think about the good things he's brought into your life and what you can do to show your support and appreciation.

Are you celebrating?

Do tell in the comments below.

If you have something to share or ask you don’t want in the comments, you can write to Keith at fullmarriageequality at protonmail dot com

Twins and Double Cousins

Throughout history, it has been more common than present-day people in densely populated areas would think for, say, a man to marry a woman and then for that man's brother to marry that woman's sister. If the larger families get along, it can make a lot of sense. It gets more attention these days when the siblings are two sets of identical twins.

Becky Pemberton reported at the-sun.com on such a situation, which is more newsworthy because both couples had children within months of each other. [This post has been bumped up so external links may no longer work.]

Brittany and Briana are identical twins who married identical twins Josh and Jeremy Salyers and then gave birth to babies within months of one another. 

 

They uploaded an Instagram post of their adorable sons Jett and Jax and said they are “Cousins, genetic brothers, and quaternary twins.”

When children are born to both of those married couples, those children are first cousins twice over to each other, or "double cousins." They are first cousins through their mothers, AND first cousins through their fathers. This is true whether or not the sisters are twins and whether or not the brothers are twins. Genetically, the double first cousins are like siblings to each other. Once they are grown, legally, those first cousins can marry in about half of US states and have sex in all but a handful of US states, whereas siblings can't legally marry in any of state and can legally have sex in only three. It's another example of how ridiculous the laws are, and another example of how genetic concerns are not the reason for unconstitutional bans on the consanguineous freedoms to sexuality and marriage.

Brittany and Briana met Josh and Jeremy at a festival for twins in 2017 and the Salyers blokes proposed six months later, following a whirlwind romance. 

 

They had a joint wedding on August 5, 2018, live in the same home in Virginia, US, and are now expanding their families together.

Twins, especially identical twins, can be very close, and as the article stated, these twins have done so much of life together, and they are living together. While the article does not say one way or the other, it isn't out of the range of possibility that this situation involves polyamory and consanguinamory. Either way, we wish them well.

Have you known of similar situations? Maybe you know of someone who ended up having marriages to more than one person from the same family? As always, feel free to comment below.

National Daughters Day

Friday, September 25, is National Daughters Day.

Celebrate daughters. All daughters, regardless of sexual orientation or relationships. 

Whether they are cis, trans, fluid, or whatever their identity, if they are daughters, today is their day.

Are you a daughter?

Do you have a daughter?

Are you celebrating?

Do tell in the comments below.

If you have something to share or ask you don’t want in the comments, you can write to Keith at fullmarriageequality at protonmail dot com 

Ethical Nonmonogamy is Not Cheating

Cheating is breaking an existing agreement or vow and keeping/intending to keep that breech of the agreement a secret from the person or people with whom it was made rather than informing the other(s) that the agreement is over (which is "leaving").

Ethical nonmonogamy is not cheating. (ENM may also be known as “consensual nonmonogamy” or “disclosed nonmonogamy.”)

For example, Mark and Jenny are swingers. Their agreement is that they will only be with others when they are both present. Anything more than a hug or kiss on the cheek with someone else, or revealing genitals to someone else in a social context, when they are not together, is a no. They attend parties together and have sex with others there; that's not cheating. But while Jenny is out of town on business, Mark picks up a woman at a bar and she gives him oral sex. Under the agreement he has with Jenny, this is cheating. Other swingers have different rules.

Some people have open relationships/marriages and a "don't ask, don't tell" policy, meaning the partners can be with others and won't ask or tell each other about who or what or when, often with certain conditions such as using protection and having STI tests. If you're not communicating with a potential partner's other partner(s), you can't be sure that being with you wouldn't involve your potential new partner cheating. Ultimately, though, at some point you just have to trust what someone tells you because establishing an absolute negative is extremely difficult. How can you be sure they don't have an agreement with some other person out there that would be breached with whatever you're doing? You can't. You can only be sure that you're not cheating on someone.*

Ethical nonmonogamy can take many forms, from lifelong spousal triads and quads (polyamory) to couples swapping to swinging to open marriages to couples engaging in the occasional casual threesome to someone living alone but having casual hookups. Informed consent is the core of all of this. While ENM is not cheating, people who profess or attempt to maintain ENM might cheat, just like monogamists might cheat. If there is a closed triad and someone in the triad has a secret lover on the side contrary to the agreement with the two others in the triad, that's cheating. "Fluid bonding" is a term used in polyamorous circles. Someone might only have unprotected sex with one person, and protected sex with others. Going without protection would be a form of cheating.

One should never assume that someone who is married or at least coupled isn't available, although one can certainly decide they don't want to be with someone who is married or coupled. That's each person's decision to make. Just because someone is married or has a partner doesn't automatically mean they aren't available for romance or sexual affection or some other social activities (meals together, going to the theatre).

While one may decide that kissing someone else is cheating and a deal breaker for their relationship, not all cheating has the same implications and risks.

How Consanguineous Lovers Can Avoid Trouble

Believe it or not, there are still criminal laws in many places criminalizing consensual sex between adults, and there are still police officers who will investigate people for this "crime," still prosecutors who will take the case before a court, and still judges and jurors who will convict people and sentence them to prison. There are still social workers who will take children away from good parents because those parents love other adults.

It doesn't matter to them how loving the relationships are. It doesn't matter if they love each other more than they could love others, it doesn't matter if the lovers didn't even meet each other until they were adults. It apparently doesn't matter to the people interfering that every dollar or minute they spend trying to stop consenting adults from loving each other is a dollar or minute that could instead go into protecting people, especially children, against predators.

In addition to this persecution of consanguinamorous people, there aren't any protections against other forms of discrimination against the consanguinamorous, such as employment discrimination. There are still many states that don't have protections for LGBTQ+ people, either, and polyamorous people are even less protected than monogamous LGBTQ+ people.

I sometimes forget that people don’t follow the news and law as closely as I do for this blog, so they may be unaware of these things. So I want to share with you what I've learned.

First, note the disclaimer that there is an ever-present at the bottom of this blog. I'll mostly repeat it here:

Sorting Out Relation

Sometimes people, especially young people, aren't certain of how to describe their relation to someone else. It doesn't help that legal relation isn't always the same as genetic (blood) relation.  People can legally be siblings, but not be close genetic relatives, for example. Or two people can be genetic siblings but not legal relatives. Relation by blood/genetics is referred to as consanguinity and relation by marriage or law may be referred to as affinity.

Generally, the law recognizes that people are related through birth*, adoption, or marriage (or civil union or domestic partnership.)

I hope this provides clarity to people who are uncertain.

If You Get Called to Jury Duty

What should you do if you are called to jury duty and are faced with being placed on a criminal case against someone you think is being prosecuted under an unjust law, such as a law against adult unmarried cohabitation, or against polyfidelity (as Utah has had on the books), or against consanguinamory? NOTE: THIS IS A PHILOSOPHICAL ESSAY, NOT LEGAL ADVICE.


The Basics of Criminal Case Juries in the US

Here in the US, people being accused of criminal activity have a right to a trial by jury or they can go with having a judge decide their case. If they go with a jury trial, the judge pretty much acts like a referee until the jury reaches a decision. The decision will be in the hands of the jury, not the judge. The judge should give you no indication of whether they think the defendant is guilty or not.

For a criminal conviction, the jury of twelve people has to unanimously decide the person on trial is "guilty" and it is supposed to be because the prosecution proved their case for guilt "beyond a reasonable doubt." If just one person (or, up to eleven people) on the jury says "not guilty" and won't budge, the case ends in a mistrial and the prosecutor can try again with another jury. If all twelve say "not guilty" then the accused is cleared of that crime and can't be retried for the same crime for the same incident. People can appeal after they've been convicted of a crime, but their appeal usually won't get them cleared.

Living Consanguinamorously - What To Tell The Children

A question many people in consanguinamorous relationships have is if, what, when, and how to tell their children about their relationship.

There is no one right answer because it depends on many different factors.

It will be great when we get to a point where it doesn’t even have to be a question, but since most consanguineous lovers are still living in places where such relationships face severe discrimination, often including imprisonment, it is a question some people have.

Most people in consanguinamorous relationships have children, whether they have those children together or by some other relationship or through adoption or third party reproduction, because most people in general have children, so this is an issue faced by many people.

Let’s consider some of the factors involved.

Labor Day Weekend

In the US, the first Monday in September is the Labor Day holiday, making this weekend an extended holiday weekend.

Friends and family often go to the beach or get together.

Although most schools now start before Labor Day, it’s still considered the cultural “end of summer,” although the meteorological end of summer always falls about September 21.

In the northern hemisphere, warm temperatures, beachgoing or poolside socializing, and perhaps some alcohol make it a festive time. 

If you have any special plans or end up having any special experiences with family or friends, tell us about it below in the comments. You can stay anonymous. For some of you, this will be a chance to make a move to initiate something you’ve wanted to do.

Be safe and have fun!

Don't Like It? You Don't Have to Do It

I get all sorts of comments submitted to this blog, and send to me through other means. Some express prejudice and bigotry. From one of those...

I definitely believe it is disgusting and wrong for a father and daughter to have a sexual relationship. I thought it was illegal in most states no matter if it is consensual or not. I can’t imagine doing that.

Let's consider this statement closely.

I definitely believe it is disgusting and wrong for a father and daughter to have a sexual relationship.

What disgusts you can influence what you do. It should have no control over what anyone else does.

What would make it wrong for two (or more) individuals, who aren't cheating, who are capable of consenting, to consent to sex? Is sex itself wrong? Or do you believe that it is only right to have sex under certain conditions in addition to consent and being free to take on a new partner? What would those conditions be? Regardless, your claim that it is wrong shouldn't have power over the rights of anyone else.

I thought it was illegal in most states no matter if it is consensual or not.

Unconstitutional laws do still remain on the books that criminalize this in 48 states. That means in two states, there is no such law. What is your objection in those two states? Or the many countries with no ridiculous laws to that effect?

I can’t imagine doing that.

Then don't. Nobody is saying you have to.

I can't imagine running a marathon. Does that mean nobody else should be free to do so?

The fact is, human sexuality and relationships are diverse. Not everyone is going to want the same things. And that's OK! There is no good reason to try to deny people the relationships to which they've mutually agreed.

There are women who have been consanguinamorous with their genetic fathers. Some have been together until their father's death, in a loving relationship with no regrets (other than not starting sooner). Why should they be denied their rights just because someone else doesn't like their love? There's no good reason.

We need to support relationship rights for all, and full marriage equality.

We Will Always Love You

RIP Queen

Dolly Parton

January 19, 1946 - August 25, 2026

May we rise to your example.

Mothers, Sons, and the Law

I'm continuing a series here of answers I posted to Quora that got attacked by censors. [This entry has been bumped up.]

*****

https://www.quora.com/Is-it-illegal-for-a-mother-to-have-sex-with-her-own-son/answer/Keith-Pullman

Is it illegal for a mother to have sex with her own son?

Keith Pullman

I network with, interview, & befriend adults with consensual incest experience.2y

It’s still illegal for a woman who have sex with her adult son in 48 states in the US and many countries.

It isn’t illegal in the US states of Rhode Island & New Jersey, as well as various modern countries, including France and Spain.

Regardless of criminalization, there are mothers and sons having sex in just about every neighborhood on the planet, regardless of class or ethnicity. And there always have been. Sometimes the sex is a very casual “family-with-benefits” agreement, sometimes it is part of a spousal relationship lasting decades, and sometimes it is somewhere along the wide spectrum between.

Very few are ever caught & prosecuted where it is still illegal, but such lovers need to be careful in order to protect themselves and each other.

*****

NOTE: These specific answers in this series were "deleted" at Quora after being there for a while and being well-received. They were probably hidden from view because some bigot targeted me, as evidenced by the fact that many were deleted in rapid fire.

I have previously appealed such deletions successfully. However, whether or not my deleted answers are restored, I’ll be adding them to this blog. You’ll see for yourself there’s no reason to delete these answers.