Tuesday, September 8, 2015

Thanks to Dr. Endrik Wilhelm

Thanks to a Friend of FME for calling my attention to this interview at with Dr. Endrik Wilhelm, a solicitor for criminal law based in Germany, about legalizing consanguinamory.

Infografik Life Links Bestrafung Inzest weltweit Englisch

There's a very good map at The Final Manifesto's blogspot. Whatever these maps depict, it would be a good idea for anyone concerned to contact attorneys or lawyers or solicitors where they live who specialize in criminal and family law to get clarification about the laws where they live.
Section 173 in the German criminal code says that sexual contact between siblings is illegal. Offenders face years in prison. Where does the problem lie in the current legal situation in Germany?

The criminal offense itself isn't even linked to the evolution of new life, it's limited to vaginal sex - irrespective of whether it's protected, whatever contraception is or isn't being used, whether or not a woman can even bear a child - all of that doesn't matter, vaginal sex between siblings is illegal, full stop.

It's not an offense to have oral or anal sex, and that's where the Federal Constitutional Court's verdict from 2008 really does get ridiculous. Don't you push a loving couple into a desperate situation once you ban them from having sex? The court said that wouldn't be the case because they'd have 'enough other options' for intercourse. This whole discussion is utterly irrational.

Isn't it ridiculous to criminalize sex between consenting adults?
When you sat in front of a sibling couple for the first time, did you have to go against your own prejudices?

As a kid, my mother explained to me that close relatives aren't supposed to have sexual intercourse because their offspring will be disabled. Apparently we had a case like that in our family. From that moment on, there was this taboo in my head, and it remained 'disgusting' until I was confronted with a legal case.

When I sat opposite the first couple, I initially still felt that way. After the first session, I spoke to my colleague who worked on the same case for hours on end. We both concluded that it doesn't matter how we feel, we don't have a right to prohibit anything. And then you slowly lose the reservations you've always had.
There used to be a time when the idea that two men could love each other was 'disgusting'. Once people thought about it in a rational manner, it became accepted and normal. I don't have the right to judge anyone, or send them to prison and least of it all, to prevent them from [loving each other] and from having children.
Minds are changing.
What's your future outlook? Do you think affected people will one day be able to live out their love normally?

I've been working on these cases for eight years now, and opinions are shifting. Eight years ago, there were waves of horror sweeping over me, now there's not a single person who doesn't say at the end of our conversation: 'That [ban] is complete nonsense.'
When people think it through, getting past any person aversion they have, they realize there is no good reason to deny consenting adults their rights.

Thank you to
Dr. Endrik Wilhelm and anyone who is fighting injustice against people in consanguinamorous relationships.
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  1. The map shows no criminal offense for the state of Michigan. Is the map wrong or is Michigan like New Jersey and Rhode Island?

    1. I haven't been able to verify. This is why people should consult lawyers.

    2. No, it is NOT LEGAL IN MICHIGAN! This map is blatantly wrong about several places. I'm amazed that it came from a reputable source. Ohio is legal for everyone but ancestors and descendants, and from what I've heard from a couple there it sounds like even that is no-longer really enforced. Michigan used to have no law criminalizing adults, but they changed the law a decade ago and now it's really harsh.

  2. It's remarkeable (and heartening) to see the number of countries where it's perfectly okay for these couples to be together, without living in fear of unjust and unfair persecution. Have any of those countries' societies fallen apart? Not that I've ever heard about.

  3. I have no idea where the editor got that "[100-150]" number. How the hell would they know?

  4. I was wondering, does anyone happen to know what would happen if a consanguinamorous couple got married and/ or live somewhere where it's legal, but then got caught or found out while they were somewhere where it's illegal? Would it still be punishable by law? Would the place they live or got married at have any say-so over the matter? Or is any legal protection they had dropped once they leave that area?

    1. Criminal acts are subject to the criminal statutes and codes of the places they are committed in. If you get married to your aunt in Canada, you can't claim marital benefits in the US; any sex act committed in a US state not Ohio, New Jersey, or Rhode Island would be considered a criminal act, and if discovered by authorities there could result in criminal prosecution. If the act was discovered to take place but you returned to Canada, the US state could still try to extradite you. This isn't anything fancy, this is just how all legal systems work. What matters is the jurisdiction of the act.


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