A Loving and Healing Marriage Denied Equality

We have yet another exclusive interview to bring you. This one is bittersweet.

As this interview is being published, there are many people still spending more time at home with family members. Perhaps some of them will find this interview an inspiration? Or they can see this for some possibilities.

People in consanguinamorous relationships are everywhere, though consanguinamorists tend to be closeted. Fortunately, some are willing to be interviewed for this blog. As a result, Full Marriage Equality has featured scores of exclusive interviews with lovers denied the freedom to marry and have that marriage treated equally under the law. Most can’t even be out if the closet or they’ll gave prosecution under absurd incest laws, which, instead of focusing on abuse, also target consensual relationships.

The woman interviewed below should’ve been free to legally marry her first husband, or simply to be together as a couple without having to hide, yet they couldn’t do either. They were consenting adults who weren’t hurting anyone; why should they have been denied their rights? In much of the world, they could’ve been criminally prosecuted for their love, and might’ve been persecuted severely in addition.

Read the interview below and see for yourself what this woman has to say about the marital bond they shared. You may think this relationship is interesting, or it might make you uncomfortable, or you might find it ideal, even highly romantic, but whatever your reaction, should lovers like these be denied equal access to marriage or any other rights simply because they love each other this way?

Also please note that someone you love, respect, and admire could be in a similar relationship right now. Should they be attacked and denied rights because of the "incest" label?

**WARNING: Mentions of child abuse.**


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FULL MARRIAGE EQUALITY: Describe yourself.

Melissa: I'm a writer  and a symphony musician. I live in a major metropolitan area in Texas with my second husband and our four teenage children. For the purpose of this interview, I’ll refer to myself as Melissa and to my brother as Matthew. These are not our real names. I still worry about repercussions should people know about the full nature of our relationship.

FME: Were you ever married or have you ever been legally and/or ceremonially married to Matthew

We were married in a Wiccan handfasting ceremony conducted by our maternal grandmother, the only relative who knew about and accepted our relationship. She was a respected member of her Wiccan community and a very wise and accepting woman. Our ceremony was private, conducted on a beach, with only ourselves and our grandmother present. We were both avid boaters, and the ocean was a very special and meaningful place for us, so it was the perfect place for us to be married. Our marriage was not a legally recognized one, but our vows were very meaningful for us. 


FME: How would you describe your gender(s)? How would you describe your sexual orientation and your relationship orientation?

I am a heterosexual cisgender female and he was a heterosexual cisgender male.  We were in a monogamous, exclusive relationship.

FME: You were in a sexual/romantic relationship with your brother? Was he your full blood brother, half brother, adoptive brother, or stepbrother?

We are full biological brother and sister. He was a year and a half older than I.


FME: What was your childhood like? What was family life like? Were alternative lifestyles/sex discussed in your family, and if so, how? Can you describe your sexual awakening?

We didn’t have a happy childhood, as we were both abused physically, sexually, and emotionally. 

I feel like I need to explain that a little bit, because it needs to be differentiated from our consensual relationship with each other. One aspect of the abuse that we went through was that we were forced to participate in porn together. So we were exposed to sexuality at too young of an age, but those experiences were not consensual and they seemed, to us, to be separate from the relationship that we had with each other. In other words, though we were forced into pornographic acts together, when we were children, we didn’t consider ourselves lovers or in love or anything of the sort; we were brother and sister who loved each other as siblings and were trying to help each other cope as best we could. 

We did eventually fall in love when we were teens, not because of the non-consensual sex, but because we had developed a relationship where we took care of, protected, comforted, and loved each other.


FME: How did sexual affection become a part of the relationship with your brother? Who made the first move?

Since we grew up in an environment where we didn’t feel safe, for as long as I can remember, starting when we were very young, whenever I was afraid at night, or whenever one of us had had a particularly abusive day, I would go into his room at night and we would cuddle up together – platonically, just two kids who wanted to be together because we were each other’s comfort. Through the years, that just became a regular thing for us: we’d go to our separate rooms, but then when the house was quiet at night, I’d come to him in his room.

Eventually, when we were both in our teens, our nights together included making love. I use the words “making love” deliberately, because that was what set our “first time” apart. By the time we started making love, we had already had sex many times in an abusive context. But that was completely different from when we made love together.

He definitely made the first move. One night, we were in bed together, holding and comforting each other as we always did, when he kissed me on the lips for the first time. That was something we had never done before - it had never been part of the abuse - and though I was kind of surprised by it, it also felt very right and I loved it. We spent most of that night kissing and making love, and from then on, we were lovers.


FME: Can you describe your feelings during that? How about “the day after”? How did that go? How were you feeling?

I sometimes write my journal entries as letters to him. I have one such letter in which I reminisce about our first night as lovers, and the morning after. I don’t think I’d be able to say it any better than I did there, so I offer it for your readers. I also have a letter that he wrote to me where he talks about his feelings about that night. 

FME: Here's Melissa's letter...

I don’t want to think anymore.  I just want to lie down and close my eyes and remember how you loved me.  I just want to remember happier times. That first kiss, spontaneous and so soft I could hardly feel it, just a feather touch, a testing of the waters, and then a pulling back to judge my reaction, a searching of the eyes, questioning, and then once more, another feather touch of the lips, one more cautious venture, and then you closed your eyes and put your forehead against mine.  Your breath caught when you realized I wanted your kiss and that I shared those feelings with you, and then all your restraint dissolved. You kissed me longer and harder, again and again, your breathing fast and trembling, whispering under your breath, “Oh, god.”  I tried to speak and you gently touched a finger to my lips and told me, “Please. . . Just let me love you,” and kissed me again and again.  So we didn’t speak any more and that was just fine. 

You gasped as if you had never been touched when I took you in my hands, and we made love for the first time because we wanted to.  In spite of all that had happened between us in the years before, you were so overwhelmed by actual lovemaking that when you held yourself shakily over me and we became as one, bliss washed over you almost immediately; but it didn’t matter at all, because, oh god, those kisses.  I kept those first kisses forever and pondered them in my heart.  You kissed me with your hand in my hair; you kissed me with your hand cupping my cheek; you kissed me as, with an expertise you shouldn’t have had at that age, your hand made me tremble against you, the expression on your face a mirror of my own rapture.  And still neither of us spoke.

The spell of silence remained all night, with your lips against mine, your hands on me, your body pressed against mine, with no words at all until we fell asleep in each other’s arms.  And then, when we awoke before the sun in the early morning hours, still okay with all that had taken place, you told me, “I don’t care if I'm not supposed to - I love you.  I’ve loved you forever.  Nothing else matters,” and the fever that had possessed you the night before broke into a calm tranquility as you loved me again, slowly and tenderly.  That was only the first of many days and nights of love that we shared, and nothing, anywhere in any time, has rivaled the pure joy of loving you.

FME: From Matthew's Letter to Melissa... 

I remember the first time I kissed you.  I was so nervous.  After I kissed you – not before.  That’s because I hadn’t realized before that I was going to do it.  You will laugh at that, probably, but it’s true.  I had loved you – in more than a brotherly way (there was still that, but also more) – for probably about two years before that.  At first, I tried to squelch it and that didn’t work, and then I tried to ignore it and that didn’t work, and then I tried just fantasizing about you and not telling you – ha!  But that didn’t work either, and then one night, without even thinking about what I was doing, it just happened:  I kissed you.  I don’t know how I got up the nerve, and I don’t know what possessed me to think it could possibly be okay.  But I kissed you.  And, oh God, you didn’t freak out.  Oh God, you let me do it and you didn’t jump out of the bed screaming that your brother kissed you.  Oh God, you let me do it again.  All of the sudden everything I’d wished for and dreamed of for so long was an actual real possibility and, oh God, it was happening right then and there.  Oh God, I was over-the-top, off-the-rails freaked out with head-spinning wonder.  I couldn’t think, I couldn’t breathe.  I was gasping for air and all I wanted was to kiss you again.  And again and again until everything else went away.  I didn’t know back then why I loved you like I did.  I know it now – it’s because of Everything that you are.  But I didn’t know it then, and it was kind of confusing.  There were a couple of girls at school that I thought were kind of cute and they had looked my way once or twice, and anyone else with half a mind would have tried their luck with one of them. 

But I only wanted you. 

I just knew I could never love them the way I loved you.  You were all the love in the world I’d ever known.  You were love itself to me, right there in my arms and, oh God, you let me kiss you and you were kissing me back and I could hear my heart beating or maybe it was yours – I didn’t know the difference anymore but I never wanted it to end and, oh God, I touched your tongue with mine and, oh God, you let me.  Oh f---, maybe I wasn’t breathing right, maybe I was dying but, oh f---, I didn’t care. I could have kissed you all night.  Forever, if you would let me. 

 

FME: Before this had you ever thought this would be possible or enjoyable; did you have any opinion one way or the other about close relatives or family members being together? Do you, or have you had feelings like this for any other close family members whether they are genetic relatives or not?

I honestly never gave it any thought before I fell in love with Matthew. I knew I loved my brother more than anyone, but until he kissed me, I hadn’t realized, at least on a conscious level, just how deeply I loved him, or in what way. 

He told me, though, that he had known for a few years before that that he was in love with me, but he had been confused about what, if anything, to do about it. I never had feelings like this for any other family members. Actually, I’ve never had feelings like this for any other human being.


FME: How would you describe the lovemaking once things got going?

Lovemaking was very nurturing and healing for us. We had both been hurt sexually and could have easily ended up with some huge emotional problems surrounding sex. But when we touched each other with such love and tenderness, when we loved and respected each other so intensely, when we both sought only the best for each other – it was the best, most passionate, amazing sex I have ever had.


FME: Describe what your relationship became. Was this a marriage, a union, girlfriend and boyfriend, what? How long were you together? Did you see each other as brother and sister, or lovers, or did those two roles become inseparable?

We were lovers for twelve years, married for nine of those years. We definitely considered ourselves a married couple. Other than the fact that we had to be very selective about who we could confide in about our relationship, we lived our lives much the same as any other married couple. I would say that, once we were living on our own, in our own home, we saw each other more as spouses than as siblings, although that aspect of a shared childhood was always a part of our relationship. Matthew told me that, when we were younger, he used to wish I wasn’t his sister, so that we could be more open about our feelings for each other, but that, as we matured, he came to see that he wouldn’t wish away any part of our relationship. Our roles as siblings took a backseat to our roles as lovers and spouses, but that shared history was still part of our relationship.


FME: Were either of you with others as well, or did both of you together involve others?

We were a monogamous couple and we didn’t involve any others in our relationship or our sexual experiences. I have since remarried, and my current husband does know about my relationship with my brother. He actually knew both Matthew and myself growing up, and he had been initially accepting of our relationship. As time has gone by, however, he has developed some animosity which I believe is rooted in jealousy as he has come to realize what an exceptionally close relationship we had. 


FME: Did you literally sleep together, or was that generally kept separate?

We slept together in a shared bed like any other happily married couple. We did have a second bedroom which served both as a guest room for anyone spending the night, as well as a “decoy” room for the purpose of giving the appearance of sleeping in separate bedrooms for the benefit of people who didn’t know the full nature of our relationship.


FME: How did your sexual/romantic relationship with your brother end?

My brother, my husband, my confidant, my best friend died of leukemia when he was 28. 

He died in my arms, after being taken off of life support – a decision in which I had no voice because I was deprived of the right to be his legal wife. I am sometimes still very broken and angry about that. I am not sure I will ever forgive the world for that. That decision was allowed to be made by the parents who had provided us with such a miserable childhood and who had hardly spoken to us in ten years, and who, after making the decision, did not even show up to see it carried out. Other than the medical staff, I alone was with him when he died. 

I had the privilege and the blessing of holding him and telling him I loved him as he left this world.


FME: Do you think it is better that you had that together, or would it have been better if that had never happened? Did it make your relationship with him better?

Being lovers and spouses absolutely made our relationship stronger. I am infinitely glad that it happened. I can’t imagine my life if I hadn’t had such a beautiful, loving relationship, at least for the short while that I had it. Even knowing how it would end, I would definitely make the same choices again.


FME: Does or did anyone in your life know the full, true nature of your relationship?

We were very selective about who we let know the full nature of our relationship, but there were indeed a few people who knew. We had a close circle of friends who knew: our five best friends, three men and two women. And, of course, our wonderful grandmother who performed our handfasting ceremony. I am involved in a close relationship with one other person who didn’t know us back then and didn’t have the opportunity to meet Matthew, but he now knows about us as well, as does my current husband. Our parents may have known or suspected, but we never outright told them, and they never outright asked. 

FME: Having to hide the full nature of your relationship from some people can be a disadvantage. Can you describe how that has been or was? Were there any other disadvantages? Conversely, do you think consanguineous relationships have some advantages and some things better than unrelated lovers, especially between siblings?

We were very fortunate that we had the wonderful friends that we did, so that, when we were with them, and not with any other people around, we didn’t have to hide our relationship. Having to keep our relationship a secret when we were out and about was definitely a disadvantage. I was a symphony musician, and when he attended my concerts, he took great delight in telling anyone who would listen that his sister was up there on stage – but he really wanted to be able to tell them it was his wife up there. 

There have been many happy moments when an appropriate reaction would have been a kiss – a lovers’ kiss – which were stifled because we were in public. My husband was a very attractive and very friendly, outgoing individual and people were naturally drawn to him. It is hard to explain what it feels like to be out for drinks with our friends, and have other women approach and flirt with my husband while, by society’s expectations, I, his wife, had to refrain from that type of interaction with him and restrict myself to the role of “only” his sister.

We were fortunate enough to be able to occasionally travel to areas where no one knew us, and it was such a joy to be able to walk down the street hand in hand, to stare dreamily into each other’s eyes over dinner, put my head on his shoulder, etc. all in full public view. 

The advantages, while not many, were strong ones. We had grown up depending on each other, taking care of each other, protecting each other. When we were in dark places where we felt unloved, we always knew we had in each other someone who loved us. We had loved each other all our lives. We knew each other’s hopes and dreams and fears so intimately that we sometimes felt as if we were truly two halves of a whole. I used to say to him that his name was the first word for love that I ever knew.


FME: What do you want to say to people who disapprove of your relationship, or disapprove of anyone having that kind of relationship? What's your reply to those who would say that this was one of you preying on the other, and that you couldn’t truly consent?

To people who disapprove of relationships like ours, I would say, to quote Bob Dylan, “Don’t criticize what you can’t understand.” I know that there are a lot of people for whom the idea of a physically intimate relationship with a relative is very off-putting - Westermarck effect, anyone? - but just because it’s not the type of relationship you are interested in pursuing doesn’t mean it should be criminalized – which it is in most places, punishable with not just a fine, but actual jail time. 

The most common rationalization given for what is actually just intolerance is the potential for genetic defects in the children of such unions. But not only is that potential much lower than commonly thought, even if it were much higher, the risk of genetic defects is not considered an acceptable reason for denying anyone else the right to choose their life partner. People who are at higher risk for having children with genetic defects for any other reason are not considered criminals if they engage in behaviors or relationships which might end up producing offspring. Indeed, most people would consider it both morally wrong and cruel to tell people who are carriers for genetic defects or hereditary diseases, people who have undergone chemotherapy, or people who have already had one child with a genetic abnormality – all of whom carry a higher-than-average risk of having a child with a genetic defect – that they have no right to have children, and even more cruel to threaten them with imprisonment if they engage in relationships that could result in having children. No one would recommend such denial of personal liberties. Yet, that very same rationale is used on a regular basis to deny the rights of consenting consanguineous couples while allowing people who are merely intolerant of a type of relationship they find off-putting to claim a moral high-ground.

I adamantly disagree with the notion that our relationship was predatory in any way. Predatory behavior is not a hallmark of consanguineous relationships. In our case, we were very close in age. He was 18 months older than I, and we both had a tremendous amount of love and respect for one another. There was no using of each other; we built a life together wherein we related to each other as equals and valued each other’s thoughts, ideas, and feelings.


FME: If you could have been legally married, and that included protections against discrimination, harassment, etc., would you have done so? Or was it a different kind of relationship than that?

We absolutely would have gotten legally married if we were able to do so. Emotionally, physically, spiritually, we considered ourselves married – in every way except legally.


FME: Did you have children together?

We discussed it at length and made a conscious decision not to have children. If we had known then what I know now about the statistics of children of related couples, we may have made a different decision, as we both liked children, and he, in particular, had great affinity for kids and would have been a wonderful father. At that time, though, with the information we had, it seemed a prudent decision not to have children. We didn’t consider that to be a viable option for us, and as much as we valued the opportunity to be parents, we valued our relationship with each other more.


FME: What advice do you have for someone who may be experiencing these feelings for a relative or family member, especially a sibling?

While I wouldn’t advise anyone to purposely seek out such a relationship, because, due to societal expectations and prejudices,, it can be a very difficult situation, I would also say that, if this type of relationship has started developing naturally, not to be intimidated and go ahead and let things progress naturally in their own time. If it is something that everyone involved feels strongly about, it is possible, in spite of societal prejudices, to make it work in a way that is beneficial and satisfying for all involved.


FME: What advice do you have for family members and friends who think or know that relatives they know are having these feelings for each other? 

If you are at all able to be supportive, please do so. It is very difficult for those of us in these types of relationships to deal with consistent disapproval of something that is such an integral part of our lives. Just having a few people who are accepting can make a tremendous difference for people in consanguineous relationships. If you don’t feel you can be supportive, at the very least, try your hardest to refrain from using such derogatory descriptors as “disgusting,” “crazy,” “weird,” or “wrong” to describe their relationship. It is very heartbreaking to hear such terms bandied about in reference to the loving connection they feel for each other. They already know perfectly well that that’s how the general public views them; they won’t benefit from your reiteration of it.


FME: Have you met in-person or do you know anyone else who has experience with consanguinamory or consanguineous sex that you know of?

I have never had the privilege to know personally any other people involved in consanguineous relationships. Though I knew from a statistical standpoint that there existed other people like us, until I discovered the Full Marriage Equality website, I never heard or knew about anyone involved in this type of relationship except for my husband and I.


FME: Any plans for the future?

It has been a long and difficult journey, healing from the loss of my Matthew. I love him more than I could possibly express, and he was everything good in this world to me. All these years later, not a day goes by that I don’t think of him and miss him. But more and more, the memories of him make me smile and bring me comfort, rather than such debilitating pain. He was one of those people who just genuinely loved his fellow human beings, and it was obvious in all his interactions. As I continue to move forward into the future, I try to remember that about him, and how happy he was and how much joy he brought to everyone around him. It gives me great happiness to continue that – to carry that forward into my relationships with other people.


FME: Anything else to add?

Thank you for providing this format for those of us in these relationships to tell our stories. It was very beneficial for me to read about other people with these types of experiences, and I felt less alone because of it. I hope that sharing our story helps someone else know that they are not alone. 

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Related: Being Consanguinamorous After Abuse 

Clearly, these lovers were consenting adults who weren't hurting anyone, and yet they wouldn't even be able to exercise their basic human right to marry as things are now. They loved each other and were happy, yet they were denied fundamental rights. They couldn’t even be open about their love without risking prosecution! Anyone who’d deny such lovers their healing, equality, and freedom should be ashamed of themselves.

Why should they have been, or anyone else like them now be, denied their rights? There’s no good reason. We need to recognize that all adults should be free to be with any and all consenting adults as they mutually consent, and part of doing that is adopting relationship rights for all, including full marriage equality sooner rather than later. People are being hurt because of a denial of their basic human rights to love each other freely.

You can see for yourself the very real harm there was for them because of a lack of marriage equality.

You can read other interviews I have done here. As you'll see, there are people from all walks of life, around the world, who are in consanguinamorous relationships.

If you are in a relationship like this and are looking for help or others you can talk with, read this.

If you want to be interviewed about your "forbidden" relationship, or that of someone you know, connect with me by checking under the "Get Connected" tab there at the top of the page or emailing me at fullmarriageequality at protonmail dot com or see here.

If you know someone who is in a relationship like this, please read this.

Thank you, Melissa, for doing this interview about your beautiful consanguinamorous relationship! We wish you well in life and ongoing healing and overcoming from your abuse and loss.