Do These Relationships Work?

A search phrase that once brought someone here on which I want to focus is…

"do incest relationships work"

To answer that, one must describe what means for a relationship to "work."

For some people, a relationship only "works" if it is heterosexual and always monogamous, involves religious and civilly affirmed marriage, produces (or at least raises) children, and lasts until one of the spouses dies.

For me, a relationship "works" if you are, as a whole and excluding artificial negatives like prosecution and discrimination, better off as a result of having been in the relationship. What makes you "better off" is up to you. It could be strictly that you enjoyed this person's company, but it could also be that you had children together, or helped each other grow as people, or made new friends through the other person, or helped each other's careers, or... well, any number of things. A relationship doesn't have to last until death to leave you better off.

A sure sign a relationship isn't working is if one of you is abusing the other, or you're abusing each other.

Over the years, I've been fortunate enough to talk with countless people who've been involved in consanguinamory. A few of them have even been generous enough to be interviewed. For most of the people I've talked with, the relationships have worked. If the consanguinamory is in the past, they have fond memories of the great times that were shared and the emotional growth they had as a result, even the sexual confidence they developed. For many, the relationship continues and provides times of unmatched bliss and intense intimacy, even shared parenting that they have found fulfilling.

So yes, they can and do work.

And, by the way, some of them are heterosexual, always monogamous, produce and raise great people, and last until death, and it is an injustice that they are still discriminated against under the law whether it not they check off any of those boxes.

National Sons Day

In the US, Sunday, September 28 is National Sons Day.

Celebrate sons. All sons, regardless of sexual orientation or relationships. 

Whether they are cis, trans, fluid, or whatever their identity, if they are sons, it is their day.

Are you a son?

Do you have a son? If you have a son, it's time to think about the good things he's brought into your life and what you can do to show your support and appreciation.

Are you celebrating?

Do tell in the comments below.

If you have something to share or ask you don’t want in the comments, you can write to Keith at fullmarriageequality at protonmail dot com

National Daughters Day

Thursday, September 25, is National Daughters Day.

Celebrate daughters. All daughters, regardless of sexual orientation or relationships. 

Whether they are cis, trans, fluid, or whatever their identity, if they are daughters, today is their day.

Are you a daughter?

Do you have a daughter?

Are you celebrating?

Do tell in the comments below.

If you have something to share or ask you don’t want in the comments, you can write to Keith at fullmarriageequality at protonmail dot com 

Polyamory is Not Synonymous With Promiscuity

Polyamorists are diverse. About the only thing all polyamorous people have in common is that they are 1) people and 2) polyamorous. There are polyamorous people everywhere, and there always have been. Some tend to conform to the larger culture around them and seem as "average" as can be, some are countercultural. Polyamorists vary in sexual orientations, philosophies, faith traditions, political affiliations, lifestyles, and just about every way humans can be diverse.

They are also diverse in how they live out polyamory, which is why "polyamory" is definitely not synonymous with "promiscuity" if promiscuity is defined as "the practice of having casual sex frequently with different partners or being indiscriminate in the choice of sexual partners."

Some polyamorists never engage in casual sex and are very particular about their choice of sexual partners, and some will have fewer sexual partners over the course of their life than many people who identify as monogamous. Yes, there are some polyamorists who are promiscuous, but promiscuous polyamorists aren't the only people who are promiscuous.

None of this is to intended to be negative towards casual sex or promiscuity. just to clarify that polyamory and promiscuity are not the same thing. Someone can have two lifelong partners they didn't have sex with until well into their relationship and be polyamorous. And just because someone enjoys some casual sex with a few different people doesn't mean, necessarily, that they are polyamorous.

One of the beautiful things about letting consenting adults negotiate their own encounters and relationships without laws or other forms of discrimination interfering is that you can have things the way you feel is best and your neighbor can have completely different relationships, and you and your lovers can all have what you need. This is yet another reason to support full marriage equality and relationship rights for all.

Frequently Asked Question: Can Siblings Marry?

The following is based on my understanding. I’m not at attorney and this should not be considered legal advice.

Can siblings marry?

I’m not aware of any government that will currently and knowingly marry full-blood siblings or recognize a marriage of full-blood siblings; rather, if it was discovered by the authorities after an official marriage was formed that the spouses were, in fact, siblings, the marriage would be dissolved and considered invalid. If the spouses knew they were siblings when they married, they would be subject to prosecution. If they discovered the genetic relationship after getting married, they would have to file for an annulment or dissolution or risk prosecution.

Where sibling consanguinamory isn’t still banned by law, siblings can have a wedding ceremony and live the married life, although under discrimination, as their government will not recognize their marriage and they will not get treated equally. Consulting a family law or estate attorney might be worth it for siblings who want some of the legal aspects of marriage. DO explain to the attorney of you genetic/legal relation as siblings. DO NOT tell the attorney you are lovers. Explain you would prefer each other to essentially be next of kin and reciprocal beneficiaries over and above anyone else (like your parents or another sibling); you want as much of a personal-social partnership as the law allows. 

Intergenerational Relationships Can Work

Are you in or considering an intergenerational relationship? Are you against such relationships?

By “intergenerational,” I’m talking about ADULT generations. I’m talking about CONSENTING ADULTS. I just wanted to get that out of the way. I’m not talking about adults preying on minors, pedophilia, etc.

The Bad

Although not illegal, nonconsanguineous relationships between adults with a sizable age difference do face prejudice and discrimination. Stereotypical assumptions, expressed as though they are automatically negative, are made about both the younger and older people involved in such relationships.

The older person, depending on age/gender, is often said to be:

What Genealogists Know

With each previous generation you trace back, the maximum possible number of your genetic ancestors doubles. You can have 2 parents, up to 4 grandparents, up to 8 great-grandparents, up to 16 great-great-grandparents, etc.

On average, there are about four generations per century. For people born in the year 2000, their 8 great-great-grandparents were probably born around 1900. Sometime around 1800 their great-great-great-great-great-great-grandparents were born (there may be up to 128 of them). About 29 generations back, or roughly around the time of 1250-1300, the total number of your possible ancestors for that generation equals or exceeds the total population of the planet, which was about 500 million people.

What gives? Well, first of all, if all 500 million of those people were your ancestors, they would also be the ancestors of all of the rest of us, too.

Secondly, you probably don’t have every person alive back then as your ancestor. There wasn’t a lot of interracial or intercultural parenting going on back then. People were more isolated, more people lived in rural countrysides rather than dense urban areas, and people were not nearly as geographically or socially mobile as they are today. It was very common for a person to be born in and to die in the the same village or town, having lived all of her or his life there.

This means that for many, many, many, many generations, there was a lot of what most people would call today “inbreeding.” If your spouse wasn’t your first cousin, your spouse was likely a second or third cousin, or a second cousin-once removed, or even your double-cousin, etc. And as I’ve noted before, even if they weren’t marrying them, people were having children with siblings, aunts or uncles, etc. (Even if not having children together, what do you think went on, given that pubescent teens, like most children, were usually sharing a bedroom?) Not only did these things not destroy humanity, but in Europe, the Renaissance was birthed in these conditions.

Coming back to around 1800, very few people are likely to have 128 great-great-great-great-great-great-grandparents, just like very few of those people in 1800 had 128 of them in 1600. Because chances are, some of your recent ancestors were cousins, if not closer. If you marry your first cousin, you have no more than six genetic grandparents between you, instead of eight. If your parents are first cousins, you have six great-grandparents instead of eight.

If “inbreeding” was as detrimental as common misconception says, none of us would be here.