New Generic Look

Every once in a while, I'd get a comment that the colors/graphics were not friendly to some eyes. I want this blog to be as readable as possible. I'd like to avoid a generic white background with black type if I can. For now, this is it.

Please see this posting if you think you can help the look for this blog.

Laws Applied to Consanguineous Interactions Being Reconsidered

Incest laws are being reconsidered in various places, and that has made some news. As we have argued and demonstrated many times on this blog, consensual sex and relationships should never be criminalized or discriminated against, and should not be lumped together with assault/abuse/molestation, which is something completely different and that laws should treat very seriously.

At ozarksfirst.com, Laurie Patton writes about what is happening in Missouri.

When children are sexually victimized, the crime is usually committed by a relative or someone else close to the victim.

Of course. This is like saying people are much more likely to get into automobile accidents within a certain distance from home. That is where they are most of the time.

A Burning Love Denied Equality

By my count, this is the thirty-first ongoing relationship I've covered through exclusive interviews in which the lovers are denied the freedom to be open about their love and are denied the freedom to marry and have that marriage treated equally under the law.

David and Athena are, as you'll see, intelligent and productive members of society. Their love for each other is beautiful.  Yet they face discrimination and prejudice for their love. They're names have been changed to protect them.

Read the interview below and ask yourself if there is one good reason these two consenting adults should be denied their rights or should have to hide.


*****



FULL MARRIAGE EQUALITY: Describe your background and who you are.

Athena: I am a 35-year-old litigation paralegal. I have an Associate’s degree in Paralegal Studies and a Bachelor’s degree in Business Management. I do not have any children nor have I ever been married. I live by myself but David and I plan on moving in with each other within the next six months.

David: I’m 47 and I have a BS in Biology. I am extremely well read. My maternal grandparents raised me and Grandma was a librarian. I am a lab tech and do research in the automotive industry. I am 5’8” 195 lbs. I have lifted weights since I was 10. I also play racquetball and do cardio at the gym. I have dark brown hair and blue eyes. I have five half-siblings and no children of my own. I live in the US in the Great Lakes area. I am told I have a good sense of humor but have an intense personality. Whatever I do I am all in. I have not been married. I currently live alone.

Search of the Day

Someone came to this blog via this search…

How do I get my mom to want incest?

One of the most frequently asked questions about consaguinamory (consensual incest) is how the asker can initiate such activity. As usual, this answer is about consensual sex, not abuse, child molestation,etc. Please note that this is assuming all people involved are independent legal adults and in places where such activities are not illegal.

There is no one-size-fits-all answer, because people are different and relationships are all different. As such, only very generalized information can be provided unless an asker talks one-on-one with someone who might be able to help.

The Bad News

It may not be possible. The matter can be as simple as… they’re not attracted to you and nothing will change that, or they simply are not interested or willing to have sex with you and nothing will change that. And that needs to be respected, because a person’s feelings and boundaries are their own and sex or lovemaking can only be something that is by mutual consent. Coercion, force, etc. means it isn’t sex or lovemaking; it is assault and abuse.

It is even more complicated when it comes to family members or relatives, because of what has been described as the Westermarck effect and societal prejudices. Because of those things, a person may have a history of demonstrating a strong attraction to people very much like the asker, and yet may not have an attraction to the asker or may have an attraction but may not be willing to consider the asker as a sexual partner. Whether it is an internal, biological mechanism or a result of socialization, many people are turned off to this. In the case of a parent or other older relative, it could be just of a matter of them seeing the asker as their little boy or little girl (even though they are grown) that overrides all else.

The Good News

Some people do it. Not everyone experiences the Westermarck effect. In the cases of genetic relatives raised separately, there is often a very strong attraction, but even when there was no separation in their lives, some close relatives have active attractions (think about it… if the asker has such an attraction, obviously some do) and sometimes those attractions are reciprocated. Even if not actively experienced, they can be awakened.

So, it does happen. Consanguineous lovemaking, sex, or experimentation is common enough that everyone knows someone who is, or has been, involved, and this has been a reality for all of human existence.

So, What To Do?

1. First and foremost, the asker should consider if they really want to try this. This is what I’ve written about that. Some of what is below rehashes some of what I wrote there.

2. The next important question is, do they know what is it they want? Is the asker looking for a fling, a family-member-with-benefits situation, a life partner… what?

3. Is the person available? Even if they are not in a closed relationship, they may not be available for a sexual relationship, for whatever reason. Determining this might be part of the overall tactical approach.

4. Send signals. Signals are more effective when the other person is looking for them, meaning they already have a mutual interest in making the relationship sexual. There are two general categories of signals one should send:

   a) "I'm a sexual being." This will be necessary if the other person is not already thinking about it, because they are thinking of the asker strictly as a son, or brother, or sister, etc.

   b) "I want you." Compliments, for example. Not crude or rude, but maybe a little more on the romantic or sexual side. The asker should let the other person know that the asker has respect and admiration for what they have to offer as a partner and their sexuality.

For either of those, flirting, playful teasing, jokes, and general double entrendres can send signals while also allowing plausible deniability so as to minimize the risk of embarrassment or awkwardness. The same goes for bringing up a news story or a book/movie/television show/song where consensual incest is an element, even if it has to be made up. For example, saying "I was reading that [insert the name of country] was considering legalizing consensual incest, and I thought it was kind of strange it was outlawed to begin with. Did you know that?"

Another signal is increasing the physicality of the relationship. For example, if you typically hug each other, then that would be keeping the embrace longer.

The specifics ultimately depend on the people involved, and their personalities and history together. In some cases, a vacation away together with plenty of wining, dining, dancing, etc. will move things along. For others, it would be a quiet evening together at home. For some, a dare would not be unusual. For others, a massage. Consider appealing to your love one's intellect (be prepared to answer concerns), heart, and libido.

5. Here’s what NOT to do in this asker’s specific case (trying to woo his mother), despite what may be depicted in erotic stories or videos…

• As I said above, do not force yourself on anyone.
• Do not violate her privacy (like spying on her when she is expecting privacy) or take her things (such as her underwear)
• Do not expect that by suddenly waving an erection around (assuming you have a penis) or “getting caught” masturbating that mom will turn into your unbridled, passionate sex kitten.

Those things will usually only work in fiction. In case you haven’t noticed, fiction, especially involving fantasy, often departs from what happens in reality.

6. Consider the future.

The Final Manifesto Defends Consanguinamory

The Final Manifesto has provided an awesome defense of consanguinamory as part of a right to full marriage equality.

A Couple of Questions About Bigamy and Polygamy

Answered in our Tumblr.

Search Phrase of the Day

Someone found this blog by searching...

is sibling incest on the increase?

I'm going to assume the search was about consensual incest, not assault or abuse. Sibling consanguinamory is one of the most common topics on this blog. See, for example, Ten Myths About Sibling Consanguinamory and the interviews I have done with sibling lovers.

The question asked in the search is part of the larger question of how common consanguineous sex is.

At least one study in the 1970s, if I recall correctly, showed that by the time people were in their early 20s, over 10% of them had consensual sexual contact with a sibling.

Some amount of sibling experimentation, and even lifelong spousal relationships, has been going on for all of human history. It goes on in other species, too.

One might argue that, as populations have shifted from sparsely populated rural areas to densely populated urban areas, humans have had other people to be with, and thus this kind of interaction with siblings has decreased. However, without even counting the increase in Genetic Sexual Attraction, the shift away from general sexual repression likely means sibling involvement has increased, even more so if someone counts stepsiblings. The figures from the 1970s are no doubt lower that the statistics one might find today.

So the TL;DR on this is yes, it has increased.

The Benefits of Polyandry

With Kenya passing a law that allows polygyny, I wanted to bump this up.

This piece from Kenya discusses polyandry, which is one wife with multiple husbands; in this hypothetical, five husbands.

I have come up with a few advantages and I mean practical advantages of polyandry

Greater economic power (multiple breadwinners, single mortgage)

Death of a parent less likely to result in poverty or destitution for the remaining family members

Common household tasks spread among more people

More personal time available to all members, without depriving children of attention

Potentially more enjoyable sex life without the risk of venereal disease

Less likelihood of being left for another man because if I fancy a 6th he will just join the gang

I’m sure you can think of more.

Just one major drawback - the jealously factor polyandry can only work with full, enthusiastic consent of all involved.

Consent is essential.

So Just like all the men advocating for poplygamy I am advocating for one wife many husbands. can I hear an AMEN sisters and brothers?

There are both men and women who advocate polygyny (multiple wives, one husband) and, for that matter, polyandry.

Request For GSA Experienced

As always, I advise caution in dealing with journalists and media personnel. They may not portray you or GSA in a positive or accurate light by the time they are done with what it is they are doing. Also, there is the matter of privacy. However, if people who've experienced Genetic Sexual Attraction do assist the media, perhaps the net result will be positive as more people learn about GSA. Raising awareness is good.

This request was posted at Experience Project by an account listed as littlestar89 22-25 F.

Hello everyone, I came across this group and have read through some really interesting and remarkable stories. It sounds like some of you have come on a real journey.
I am a feature writer for women's magazines in the UK and I am interested in speaking to people who've experienced GSA, for a women's magazine feature. 

I'm really keen to raise awareness for GSA in order to help people who are experiencing feelings that may confuse them - I really think that reading about other people's experiences could help them. 

If anyone is interested in sharing their story in a UK magazine, I'd really love to speak to you. 

You'd be paid for your stories, and we can guarantee that we will read back to you what has been written, before anything is published, to make sure you are 100% happy with what has been written. 

If anyone is interested, or has any questions, please don't hesitate to get in touch: cher.heasmer@pressassociation.com

As always, you can share with me your experiences with GSA, and I will not trash you nor violate your privacy. My contact information is in the commenting instructions.

A Positive Introduction to Polyamory

At thelinknewspaper.ca, Madeleine Gendreau writes about some of the benefits of polyamorous relationships.

I never really considered the concept of being in relationship with different people simultaneously as having a name, or any sort of connotation at all. It was just a thing that happened, a friendship that shifted, with the added benefit of a sexual relationship.

That happens a lot.

There is never one template to define relationships, regardless of how many parties are involved.

That is important to remember.

Different people have different definitions of what polyamory is; James sees it as a matter of primary and additional relationships.

Ask two polyamorists, you might get three definitions.

Anna found it helpful to view her sexual relationships as extensions of friendships. “A healthy relationship is a solid friendship foundation,” she says. “You don’t have only one friend at a time, so in the same way, if you meet someone else who is cool your friend hopefully doesn’t get territorial and make you decide.”

That's a good way to look at it.

And above all, it was the communication, consent, and the continuous checking-in with one another that has kept that particular relationship strong, not the number of people involved.

At this point in my life I have found myself in a series of polyamorous relationships. The people I choose to spend time with each fulfill different facets of my life that make me happy.

Glad to see another positive piece on polyamory.

Doing What the Royals Did?

Out of Egypt comes this very interesting story, found at emirates247.com, about someone doing what the Egyptian royals (and non royals) did throughout history... have sex with a sibling.

An Egyptian woman who moved in with her husband to her brother’s apartment became involved in an affair with her brother while her husband filmed them.

Before anyone asks... no, I don't have a link to the video.

Sabra told police that poverty pushed her to do so and that she enjoyed sleeping with her brother more than with her husband Mohammed.

I can understand poverty causing them to move in together. I know that people typically report consanguineous sex to be the best they've ever had.

When her brother’s wife discovered the relationship, she angrily left home

Ah, so this was cheating?

and went to live with her brother.

Hmmmm.

After telling her brother why she left, he proposed that they all sleep together in the same bed.

Interesting. Was this adapted from something printed by Penthouse? If this is serious, my guess is that some of the people involved had this planned out.

“My husband knows about this and to be frank, he encouraged me to do this.

“He even films us when I have sex with my brother. It became an addiction.”

 Like I said, it can be an unparallelled experience.

Newspapers quoted Mohammed as telling the court “We were very happy until our neighbour discovered the affair and started to put pressure on us to have sex.

“When we refused, he reported us to the police.”

A rat.

The papers said the couples refused to file any complaint, prompting the prosecutor to release them all.

Which papers? We don't know. Maybe somebody is just trying to get hits?

Interesting Search Phrase of the Day

Here's how someone got to this blog. They searched for...

how to tell if someone is having consensual incest

Well, one way would be to catch them in the act. However, if that involves snooping, barging in to private areas, being a peeper, etc... well, that's not so good.

Another way would be to notice if they're always smiling and glowing like they've having the best sex ever. Just kidding. Kinda.

Seriously, observing how they behave around the person(s) you think they are secretly with or how they talk about that person might give it away. When people are in love, it can be hard to hide.

The question I have is, why does this person want to know? If it is just curiosity, assume whatever you'd like to. Just don't talk about it to others because it really isn't anyone's business, and since consanguinamory is still criminalized in many places and consanguineous lovers are otherwise subjected to discrimination, they shouldn't be outed (unless they are someone, such as a prosecutor or legislator, perpetuating discrimination against other consanguineous lovers.)

If someone wants to know because they want to be supportive, that's another matter. Here's the advice I have written for people who are friends and family of consanguineous lovers. The Final Manifesto has this excellent advice for friends and family of consanguinamorous siblings. [That link might not be working, so try this.]

The trick to getting someone to confide in you that they are involved on consanguinamory is to signal to them that they can. The way to do this to convey the message that you 1) do not condemn consanguinamory, 2) care about them, and 3) can keep a secret. 

Communicating #1 can be as easy as saying something like (especially if you have one of them alone), "I was reading about a country that is considering repealing laws against consensual sex, particularly a law they have against close relatives having sex. I was surprised some places still have laws like that. I mean, if they are consenting adults, what's the big deal?" Or if you live in the US, you can say something like "I was reading about how different states have different laws. I was surprised to read that a couple states still criminalize consensual sex between first cousins, and that only a few states do not have any laws against consensual incest, no matter how closely related. I would think most, if not all states, would have repealed such ridiculous laws against consensual sex."

The worst-case scenario is that they are not only NOT involved, but they disagree with your statement, in which case you can ask them why they disagree. If they accuse YOU of wanting to be involved, you can point out that someone doesn't have to secretly want someone of another race to support interracial marriage, or someone doesn't have to be a woman to support women's rights. Otherwise, they may shrug their shoulders or agree, but not reveal anything to you (at least not right away.) That could be because they aren't involved. Or, they may open up to you, which would be great because most people in consanguinamorous relationships really appreciate support and someone to talk with.

There are other ways of communicating #1 or furthering the point, such as saying you read someone talking about these books, or saying you were reading about how common it is and that everyone knows someone involved, and asking, "What do you think about that?"

Another way is saying that you notice that in discussions about marriage equality, some people want to keep denying close relatives their freedom to marry and you just can't think of a good reason why someone would want to stop people from being together if they love each other.


Another way that might work, if their facade is that they aren't in a relationship with anyone, or they've been mysterious about who they are seeing, is to say something like, "I want to be happy. If you're happy not being in a relationship, I support you. And if you're in a relationship, as long as everyone involved in a consenting adults, I support you."

The trick is to give them enough wiggle room to pick up the ball and run with it, if they are ready to. They may not, or may not do it right away, but there are ways of letting them know you would be supportive that are not likely to give someone who ISN'T involved the idea that you think ARE involved. You can also prevent a misunderstanding by saying something like, "I don't have any secret crushes on relatives myself, but it isn't wrong to have them."

Polyamory is Rising, Solidarity is Best

This piece at inquisitr.com asks, "Is Polyamory the New Same-Sex Marriage?" It starts with the rise in visibility of polyamory, then gets very strange...

The idea of not only tolerating but encouraging what we’ve been socialized to see as the worst possible betrayal of a partner is certainly jarring — even if a committed relationship survives what we see as “infidelity,” it’s considered one of the literal worst things an adult human can endure in their lives.

Say what? This is not cheating. If a polyamorous person is in a committed relationship, polyamory involves the agreement of the other person(s) in the relationship. And, sometimes, their participation. This is an entirely different dynamic than cheating.

The issue is a sticky one, threatening not only to create a ton of legal and societal quandaries,

Sounds like Discredited Arguments #2, 11, and possibly 12, 13, and 14. Adaptable laws are already in place.

but also — if we’re being honest, if someone curmudgeonly — undermine the shaky and tenuous gains made by the marriage equality movement.

That's like saying rights for Latino Americans undermined the gains made by the racial equality movement. Equality just for some is not equality. The polyamorous or polygamous freedom to marry is part of full marriage equality just like the same-gender freedom to marry is, and sometimes they overlap as some LGBT people are polyamorous. Solidarity will help, not hurt, LGBT monogamists.

After all, didn’t opponents of same-sex marriage loudly predict that “polygamy” would soon follow, with men seeking to marry multiple wives once the institution of marriage was “destroyed” by extending the rights to our gay brothers and sisters?

Although broken clocks can be right twice a day, bigots who make such statements should be met with "What's the harm of letting adults marry any and all consenting adults?" Marriage equality strengthens marriage; it doesn't destroy it.

The piece ends with...

It seems polyamory is destined to present a redux of the same-sex marriage debate, and will shape up to be the same exhausting fight. But at the end of the day, are we arguing about whether to admit and accept a long-practiced thing, and does legal recognition make any change in how people choose to live their lives going forward?

It really isn't complicated. An adult, regardless of gender, sexual orientation, race, or religion, should be free to share love, sex, residence, and marriage (and any of those without the others) without prosecution, bullying, or discrimination.

The polygamous freedom to marry, and acceptance of polyamorous people, will come about faster.

Canada Needs to Keep Evolving

Ada Slivinski at sunnewsnetwork.ca wrote about polyamory in Canada...

People in this community say many who live this way are still in the closet.

Yes, many are because of prejudice and discrimination against nonmonogamous relationships.

"I think it's something we should accept about each other and if there's people who are into that kind of thing, great," said sex and relationship coach Julia Saunders.

Good for her.

"I think if three people want to get married, why not," said Mark Bentley Cohen, who lives in a non-monogamous marriage with his wife Lianna Walden.

There's no good reason to deny this freedom to marry.

Researchers who study family relationships have concerns about what these arrangements mean for children. They worry the fluidity of polyamorous love directly counteracts the stability that is important for children's formative years.

Uh, allowing them to legally marry is likely to increase stability, even if people choose not to marry, because it will help reduce the discrimination against such families. Let's get real here. Many people are having children in unstable relationships that claim to be monogamous. An adult, regardless of gender, sexual orientation, race, or religion, should be free to share love, sex, residence, and marriage (or any of those without the others) with any and all consenting adults, without prosecution, bullying, or discrimination.

Getting Facts Into Fiction

Jaye Em Edgecliff has a blog, and on that blog wrote about taboos in fiction.

I was actually participating, not just browsing, today on the NaNoWriMo forums and incest was brought up.

Should it be incorporated into a tale?

Yes. And that some media executives won't allow it under their watch means there has been an awful lot of incestuous shipping in works by fans.

Incest.  Calls to mind scenes of brother raping sister.  Of father molesting daughter.  Of mother seduced by son.  Mostly, in today’s society, it is firmly in the public consciousness as a Bad Thing, so you say it and people do lean in the direction of rape and molestation, drugging, slavery, torture.  Even in the V C Andrews book my sister likes so much (no, I haven’t read it and I know it was a series and so am uncertain which title to reference, sorry) where the incest is treated far more consensually and even slightly more romantically … it’s in the face of abuse and isolation.  It’s not so bad, next to everything else going on in the characters’ lives – or so I gather from listening to her go on and on about it.  Even if I’m mistaken, it’s a good point and one someone has probably published.  QED.

Again, we're dealing with two different things, both of which should be written about...

1) abuse/assault and
2) consensual experimentation/sex.

Two very different things, both of which do exist, and both of which need to be addressed in fiction. It is because there is such a difference between those two things that I refer to the second as consanguineous sex or consanguinamory. Young people need to know that the first one is not OK, and the second one is not necessarily a problem.

We Get Letters About Crushes

Anonymous wrote at the FME Tumblr about a crush on a half nephew.

If you're not yet connect to us on Tumblr, or you haven't bookmarked us, do it! There is content there that doesn't make it to this blog.

Zambia Keeps Prosecuting Consenting Adults For Marrying

Another news item out of Zambia details the prosecuting of consenting adults in an attempt to break up a marriage. If you think this only happens in Africa, you are sorely mistaken. Where I live, in the US, many states still prosecute in these cases, and it happens in many other countries as well. Chambo Ng'uni reports at dail-mail.co.zm...

A 27-YEAR-OLD man of Kabwe and his young sister aged 20 have appeared in the Kabwe Magistrate’s Court to answer to charges of incest.
 
Aaron Musonda an electrician and Maureen Musonda a grade 12 pupil in Kabwe both appeared before Kabwe resident magistrate John Mbuzi on Thursday for explanation of the charge of incest.

The accused persons are both residents of Makululu Township and they share the same father but different mothers.

So they are half siblings. For all we know they were not raised together and this is a case of Genetic Sexual Attraction.

The police have slapped Musonda with a charge of incest by males contrary to Section 159(1) of the Penal Code Chapter 87 of the laws of Zambia.
 
It is alleged that Musonda on dates unknown but between December 1 last year and February 27 this year in Kabwe, knowing that Maureen was his sister, allegedly had unlawful carnal knowledge of her.
 
His sister has been charged with incest by females, contrary to Section 161 of the Penal Code Chapter 87 of the Laws of Zambia.
 

The court heard that Maureen on dates unknown but between December 1 last year and February 27 this year in Kabwe, allegedly permitted her elder brother to have sex with her.

And...? What's the problem? Notice, no explanation of harm to anyone is cited in the article.

The police at Kasanda Police Station last Friday confirmed that the two were reported to the police by their father who wanted the police to end their marriage.

What a rat. So it is OK for him to have sex with and impregnate at least two women, but not OK for other consenting adults to love each other? He should have read this.

A police source said according to their father, siblings allegedly got married last year and when their family attempted to end their affair they fled Kabwe.
 
The source said they resurfaced this year, and their family heard that they were renting a house in Makululu.

Renting a house! Oh, those scary people! Seriously, what a waste of law enforcement resources. Let them be together, and let them marry if they want. There is no good reason to deny them their rights.

Why the South Needs Full Marriage Equality

This is why the South and the rest of the US needs full marriage equality sooner rather than later. It is an interview at The Final Manifesto with a woman who is denied the right to marry the other parent of her child.

You can read interviews I have done here.

Possible GSA Case Makes News

Not everyone who is arrested or prosecuted for consensual sex is a sympathetic person overall. Sometimes, they've done other things that should continue to be crimes. Regardless of whether someone is a career criminal or a true pillar of the community, consensual relationships and sex between adults should not be a crime, and should not be fodder for ridicule in what are supposed to be serious news services. Stories like the one below are not justification to deny full marriage equality. For every situation like the one detailed below, there are many great people who are in consanguinamorous relationships and you never heard about them. Or, they are famous and admired, but their consanguinamory remains closeted.

Here is Lee Moran's article at nydailynews.com...

A Texas meth-head and his sister confessed to incest after they were caught passionately kissing in prison, police said.

Charlene Ellet, 25, and her brother Cameron Beck, 26, were allegedly busted locking lips between jail cell bars after getting arrested for possession of meth.

The Houston duo now faces prohibited sexual conduct charges on top of the initial drug allegations.

So this happened in Texas but is in a New York newspaper. Why?

Montgomery County Police Reporter said that the pair was picked up at a Wal-Mart on Friday after Ellet was caught stealing.

Deputies detained Beck, who'd driven his sister and her 2-year-old twin girls to the store, after finding traces of meth in his car.

Taken to Montgomery County Jail and placed in neighboring cells, deputies said they were stunned when the pair started kissing each other on the lips through the bars.

They should have learned from this. Texas is one of the worst states when it comes to consanguinamory. Here's why I think this is a possible case of Genetic Sexual Attraction...

Confirming they were siblings, Ellet said they had the same biological mom but that she had been adopted.

She revealed they struck up a pen pal relationship as Beck was in prison and hooked up on his release in November.

The couple lived in a motel room with Ellet's two daughters, and would often have sex behind a partition as the two girls watched TV.

Here's the coverage at examiner.com.

Here's the coverage at opposingviews.com.


Here's what appears to be the original source, montgomerycountypolicereporter.com.


And dailymail.co.uk had to carry it, too.

Newspaper Editorial Calls For Hate

A newspaper in Zambia is calling for more hate in response to recent shocking discoveries that people are loving each other even though they are siblings. Here is the editorial at daily-mail.co.zm...

THE continued reports of incestuous marriages in Central Province are worrying and raise many social and psychological questions.

What is there to worry about?

We urge relevant Government organs and non-governmental organisations to carry out a research to establish if this could be widespread and unravel the factors that could be driving people in this particular province into such marriages.

Yes, it is common. What is driving them to it is usually the same thing that drives any lovers.

This kind of behaviour should not be allowed to take root because it could have devastating social and biological consequences.

Such as...? Such as...? They got nuthin'.

Human beings are not animals that are ruled by instinct. We are ruled by reason.

Some of us are ruled by reason. Others want to interfere in the marriages of strangers.

Surely, how could a brother and sister have the courage to engage in a sexual relationship and even have children between them?

I can show you video.

This does not happen even in the most liberal and morally depraved western societies.

This happens everywhere and always has.

Incest is a criminal offence in Zambia.

Not for any good reason. 

It is disturbing to imagine the stigma the innocent children that could be born out of such a perverted marriage would have to endure.

Uh, then stop stigmatizing them.

What a pile of crap that editorial is. I hope the person who wrote it doesn't actually get paid for that drivel.

An Example of the Benefit of Nonmonogamy in Nature

I am polyamorous, but not one of those polyamorists who say everyone else should be polyamorous, too. When I say I support the rights of consenting adults, that includes the freedom to be monogamous or celibate. And, as I always say, just because something is found in another species, it doesn't automatically apply to humans. With those things out of the way, I wanted to note Carl Zimmer's report at nytimes.com that flies forced into monogamy apparently lose learning ability.

Forcing male flies into monogamy has a startling effect: After a few dozen generations, the flies become worse at learning.

This discovery, published on Wednesday in the Proceedings of the Royal Society, isn’t a biological excuse for men who have strayed from their significant other. Instead, it’s a tantalizing clue about why intelligence evolved.

The new study was carried out by Brian Hollis and Tadeusz J. Kawecki, biologists at the University of Lausanne in Switzerland. They investigated a fly species called Drosophila melanogaster that normally has a very un-monogamous way of life.

I do think it causes all sorts of problems to try to force a polyamorous person into monogamy. Human history has shown that over and over again. Also, many polyamorous people will tell you that living out polyamory has made them better people and taught them much.

New Republic Insults Hundreds of Millions

Alice Robb wrote at "The Strange Scholarship of Incest" at newrepublic.com...

Whether or not Meryl Streep deserves to win Best Actress for her turn as the deranged matriarch in August: Osage County is up for debate, but everyone who’s seen Tracy Letts’s play or the film adaptation should be able to agree on at least one thing: It makes for some uncomfortable viewing. And of all the disturbing elements that make up this saga—alcoholism, suicide, adultery—there’s one plotline that stands out as truly disturbing: the incestuous romance between Ivy and Little Charles, who believe they’re first cousins but—spoiler alert—turn out to be half-siblings.

Why is that disturbing?

Disgust seems like a pretty appropriate response to an affair between cousins, but historically, in societies around the world, marriage between cousins has been accepted and even encouraged.

And yet she calls it disgusting anyway, insulting hundreds of millions of people, including her own ancestors. Then she gets into that big question...

Is the taboo against incest a biological universal, or is it culturally derived? And if it’s a cultural construct, why is it so widespread?

Ultimately, when it comes to whether or not consenting adults should have their rights, the answer to that question isn't relevant.

“I’m not saying that it’s fine, but I think the genetic risks of incest are probably overestimated,” said Diane Paul, a professor at the University of Massachusetts Boston whose research focuses on the history of evolution and genetics.

It certainly is.

“It’s assumed it would be higher, but there’s a huge bias of ascertainment,” she explains. “If you have a baby [that’s the product of incest] with a problem, people say, ‘Oh, that’s why,’ but if the baby is healthy, no one says, ‘Look at that healthy baby’ [that’s the product of incest].”

DING! We have a winner.

“In terms of genetic distance, a half-sibling relationship is equivalent to an uncle-niece relationship or a double first cousin relationship” [double first cousins share both sets of grandparents], both of which are quite common in different societies,” says Alan Bittles, a researcher at the Centre for Comparative Genomics at Murdoch University in Australia.

Double first cousins can legally marry in some US states.

The article then gets into Westermarck.

It is very simple... if YOU are disgusted by something, don't do it. But it is rude, cruel, and unjust to try to stop consenting adults in love from being together.