[UPDATE January 2016: Apparently these people were back on television or the episode was repeated and we're getting a lot of a traffic to this entry that was first posted in May 2011. I will add more below.]
[UPDATE February 2016: The show is either repeating or has another genetic father/daughter on an new episode. If you want more information on this blog, click here. If the current episode is a new one, I haven't seen it, so I have no idea if the situation depicted is abusive or not. Not all GSA relationships are abusive; many aren't.]
*****
There continues to be much discussion about a recent pair of Steve Wilkos Show episodes on a father-daughter couple.
There has been so much hatred hurled at the father in online discussions, or against both of them.
An adult should have the right to pursue love, sex, and marriage (or not) with ANY consenting adults. Britney was 18 when she began having sex with Morgan after being reunited with him. That makes her an adult. She can consent to have an abortion at an age younger than that. She can sign up to serve in our armed forces. Either we take the age of consent laws seriously or we don't. Either we say an adult woman can make her own decisions or we don't. Either we take the freedom of consenting adults seriously or we don't. Which is it going to be?
I side with freedom. I side with love.
Just because you would not do something does not mean other people shouldn't, or that it should be illegal. Think it through, please. You don't have to like that they love each other this way. But don't be hateful and bigoted.
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Continuing the update:
There is no good reason to deny consenting adult their rights, which include the right to have sex with each other or marry each other. You might not think the people featured on this television program have a healthy relationship, but I've interviewed scores of people, most of them in lasting, happy, healthy, loving consanguinamorous relationships.
Advocating for the right of consenting adults to share and enjoy love, sex, residence, and marriage without limits on the gender, number, or relation of participants. Full marriage equality is a basic human right.
Monday, February 8, 2016
41 comments:
To prevent spam, comments will have to be approved, so your comment may not appear for several hours. Feedback is welcome, including disagreement. I only delete/reject/mark as spam: spam, vulgar or hateful attacks, repeated spouting of bigotry from the same person that does not add to the discussion, and the like. I will not reject comments based on disagreement, but if you don't think consenting adults should be free to love each other, then I do not consent to have you repeatedly spout hate on my blog without adding anything to the discourse.
If you want to write to me privately, then either contact me on Facebook, email me at fullmarriageequality at protonmail dot com, or tell me in your comment that you do NOT want it published. Otherwise, anything you write here is fair game to be used in a subsequent entry. If you want to be anonymous, that is fine.
IT IS OK TO TALK ABOUT SEX IN YOUR COMMENTS, BUT PLEASE CHOOSE YOUR WORDS CAREFULLY AS I WANT THIS BLOG TO BE AS "SAFE FOR WORK" AS POSSIBLE. If your comment includes graphic descriptions of activity involving minors, it's not going to get published.
I think this is partly rooted in the prejudiced and false belief that women (especially young women) don't want and aren't interested in sex, so if a younger woman is in a sexual relationship with an older man, she must have been coerced, ergo the man is just an abuser. Our society doesn't want women to have the power to consent. We perpetually deny the possibility that women have the ability to make conscious and deliberate choices about their sex lives, infantilizing them from womb to tomb. It drives me up the WALL!
ReplyDeleteMacha, I couldn't have written it better myself. Thanks!
ReplyDeleteEssentially, you guys are supporting incest with the justification of "love". Regardless of how big your hearts are, and how unprejudiced your flawless opinion is, "I side with freedom. I side with love", there is a line that should not be crossed, particularly when this barrier is highlighted in nature when these chemical bonds malfunction and produce children prone to retardation. She is more then old enough to consent to sex and so he is, though they both acknowledge that what they're doing is sick as a father-daughter thing, but they can't help it because they're in "love". Let's also consider the fact that she was greatly abused, and her consent is somewhat tainted by child hood trauma. Love does not justify everything, your ignorance astonishes me - A biological, sexual relationship is one that should not exist.
ReplyDeleteI have written a response to this last comment:
ReplyDeletehttp://marriage-equality.blogspot.com/2011/08/some-young-women-can-and-do-consent-to.html
A great many adult reunitings of adult brothers/sisters, fathers/daughters and mothers/sons have as aspect of sexual attraction (well known psychological problem) sans any abuse trauma. The brain associates sex/love. Most do not act on it. Its probably wisest to seek counseling. But its there. The longer I live the more I wonder how 'wrong' some of it is though. Look at the number (100s sometimes) of sperm donor children known/unknown. I can't really say if they meet, its 'just plain wrong' anymore. Not that they'd ever necessarily know. RU 2 take a test make sure you are not too closely related before having sex? 'babies' goes down another road. Can you going to forbid groups (Ashkenazi Jews, Tay-Sachs) from having kids together? At some point, when its adults, leave em the heck alone.
ReplyDeletethey should love each other. he is her effing father! but love does not translate to sex. that is just plain sick. the think this way because they are sick. brittany has been abused, and, regardless of her physical age, she is not an adult. she has not developed properly to mature to adulthood. she is being used, abused, and manipulated by the very person who is supposed to be shielding her from predators like himself. those of you who side with this couple also need help. it doesnt make you free. it doesnt make you open minded. it makes you, yes you, sick.
ReplyDeleteI agree, father and daughter, mother and son any kind of family shouldn't have sexual feelings toward themselves. That is disgusting, sick. When I first know bout the story I thought I was dreaming for a sec. I Hope one day they realize specially her that what they're doing it's wrong in any kind of way
DeleteI hope you'll realize that other adults should be free to love each other how they think best.
DeleteI agree that it is sick as well, and though we haven't mentioned religion, it plainly states in the bible Leviticus 18, Do not commit sexual sins. I won't go into all, but it specifically states NOT to sleep with CLOSE relatives. meaning your daughter, father, son, mother, yes, it even states for son's not to have sex with their fathers either. This is sick what Morgan is doing to his daughter. The mother clearly passed her lie detector test and Britney's father did not.
DeleteWe do not live under Levitical law. Citing the laws of an ancient theocracy that no longer exists in the same form hardly applies.
DeleteDo you know where Cain got his wife?
Do you know Abraham's relation to his wife?
Who did Noah's grandchildren marry?
I can see this will be a no win conversation, regardless of what I say. Obviously you agree with incest. The bible clearly states no CLOSE relatives, yes, we are all related in some way, but it is not right to sleep with an immediate relative, a father who started the life of a child has no right sleeping with that child. Think what you will,fact is fact, sleeping with a child you helped to create is SICK
DeleteI agree that adults should be free to have their relationships regardless of what your church says and even if you think it is sick.
DeleteBut since you bring up the Bibie, you'll be hard pressed to find much outside of what was supposedly given to the ancient theocracy of Israel. It's kind of like citing an Aztec law. If you want to live by that, go ahead. I support your rights to your sexuality and relationships. It would be great if you would do likewise for others.
Thanks to both Anonymous comment writers. There's been much interest in this couple lately; I figure they must have been on television again, perhaps in a rerun of their earlier appearances.
ReplyDeleteAttraction to another adult is not a psychological problem. in GSA cases it is a natural, normal reaction to the circumstances.
No, love does not always mean sex, but if adults want to love each other sexually, that should be their decision to make, not anyone else's call. You can call names and apply labels all you want, but you have not explained what the problem is. She is an adult, capable of joining the military, making contracts, operating heavy machinery, voting, and consenting to sex with a total stranger. If she choosed to sleep with a man who is her biological father, that should be her choice to make.
Yes true but she is not even old enough to drink. If u cant order yourself a drink.. or sit in a casino and gamble, how can u be old enough to consent to having sex with ur father. She was 17 less than a year ago. Was just in highschool ...some dont graduate until 18. She is still a child. Yes legally an adult but 18 eight-teen, key word teen. Not to mention the life shes been thru. Just like a child cannot consent to sex with an adult because their to young and impressionable to make that choice and therefore even if an adult gets u to agree with an adult act does not make it consensual. Most ppl look up to their parents, and believe their parents would never steer them wrong or do anything to harm them, and so, if ur father is telling u that something is okay or even just giving the impression that something is ok u want and tend to believe them. Weather in ur life or not what person doesnt want to believe ur parents dont have ur best interest in mind. U are taught to trust and believe in ur parents. He is definitely taking advantage. Maybe it wiuld be a little different if she was 25 plus which even still is young in my eyes. My concern is noone is taking into consideration trauma.. drug use.. abuse... all these things that play a part in how well we develop and mature. I truly beleive she will wake up one day after growing up soon and realize he doesnt give a damn abt her or he.never would have put her in that situation and she will resent him. Theres a reason why most father daughter sexual relationships consists of a young daughter. Do u ever see someone who is 35 in a sexual relationship with their dad? No because that is when u are old enough to say wow my dad doesnt care abt me... only abt himself. Just because ur legal does not make u responsible. I can go on and on but get real with urselves. Nothing abt this is okay. If their soulmates he shoulda told her go to college, figure out what u want and if were still in love after graduation than well work on us. After all their soulmates right? Smh ... if ur soulmates now ull be.soul mates then.
DeleteTo the first Anon: are you saying that anyone who has suffered sexual abuse can never fully consent to sex? I think that is HER choice to make.
ReplyDeleteFirst of all, she was not 18 when she started her sexual relationchip with her father. Watch the episode again, When she ran away from home she was 16. She went to the bustop. Her father picked her up. Three days later she was 18 and they had sex. So by my definition, it changes it from incest to molestation.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous, unless they have said they started having sex before she at the age of consent in her state, then she can consent to have sex with a stranger, and she should be free to consent to this as well.
ReplyDeleteYou are sick in the head if you think a father and daughter should have sex together. May God save your soul from the pits of hell! They are nasty!
DeleteThank to Steve for playing this episode over.
Regardless, If both parties are over a consensual age, this should be a civil matter and not a criminal matter not much unlike people who choose to consume alcohol, smoke cigarettes or engage in no-strings-attached premarital and/or homosexual intercourse. I agree with the unknown poster to some extent. The only thing this consanguineous couple - that is if they are actually a real couple - has going for them is their appearance on a syndicated daytime television show intended for people who are-for the most part-unemployed, with low socioeconomic status.
DeleteJesus God Almighty...you guys are ALL sick, if you believe what you are writing here, regarding it being OK, and siding with Love. So this sick bastard can continue the abuse that this little girl has been handed since, practically when she left her mother's womb, nothing BUT sexual abuse, physical/mental abuse, etc.......who in the HELL do you think you are kidding you sick shit? How much medical have you smoked today? It is OK for a father to sleep with his daughter...and you condone it, because you side with "love" if this is your idea of love, I hate to see what your idea of HATE IS.....
ReplyDeleteThere is a big difference between abuse and consensual sex, unless you are doing it wrong.
DeleteAmen to that!Once you start regarding sexual relationships with parents and their children as "okay" if they consent because its "love" you open the door to so many sick and horrible situations and ideas. If a father had abused his daughter her whole life and brain washed her to believe as an adult that it was "love" and they had a adult sexual relationship would that be okay because she was over 18? How far will your believing in "love" go? In this situation the young lady had years of abuse from all sides and her "father" knew who she was from birth.Even spending time with her at as an older child past ten years of age. They did not did not just meet one another and not know they were father and child. This "I believe in love" mentality is just what child molesters use when defending themselves for abusing children. Lots of parents who sexually abuse their children use manipulation to brain wash their children into believing it is okay. making it a lot easier for someone who had such a horrific abusive lonely childhood already to actually believe that it.
ReplyDeleteUm, abuse and coercion would still be illegal. Rape would still be illegal. Child molestation would still be illegal. "Grooming" would still be illegal abuse. Consensual sex between adults has NOTHING to do with child abuse.
Deleteis okay. Further more you don't stop being someones child just because you turn 18. Any parent who can look at their child and have a sexual want for them is by no definition of right, good, decent, or well person no matter how you want to word it. It is abuse and neglect that led this young lady to find comfort in her "father" only to find herself being sucked into another sad, sick, manipulated, situation instead of a loving parent that would be there for her as a REAL FATHER and do his best to make her life better. Any parent that actually loved their child right and not just as a sick sex object would NEVER have felt or allowed this to happen because it IS only going to hurt her and no parent wants their child to be hurt in any way.
ReplyDeleteYou have no understanding of Genetic Sexual Attraction, and you write as though consensual sex is a bad thing. Perhaps you are doing it wrong, if at all.
DeleteThank you ! Clearly the second was enjoyable for both!
DeleteAnd you write as if doing it right is doing it with your children and if that is the case I think most people are not doing it "right" and CPS should pay a visit to your house.
ReplyDeleteAre you deliberately being ignorant? What part of "consenting ADULTS" do you not understand? Why would you think CPS would care if someone supports the rights of CONSENTING ADULTS? I do not support adults preying on children, regardless of relation.
Deletehey! Lets all bring kids into the world and fuck the shit out of them! Maybe we can teach our kids about orgies too! Now Lucy, touch Johnnys peepee!
ReplyDeleteNo need to use four letter Anglo-Saxon words considered impolite in many circles.
DeleteWhat you describe sounds like child abuse and grooming. This case is nothing like that. It is about Genetic Sexual Attraction and grown people making decisions about their own bodies.
If you have something of substance to write, go ahead. But if you're just going to attack the love and affection of consenting adults, we've heard that all before.
Hmm, I almost respect your point of view. Cause your right, she is a consenting adult. Not saying I support incest. I'd never sleep with a family member, and it grosses me out slightly. But whatever floats your boat. But that doesn't mean she isn't being (or can't be) taken advantage of. Britney and Morgan made another appearance on the show, Morgan clammed that Brittney's mother prostituted her for drugs and tried to kill her. And that she blind folded her, stripped her, and "let guys touch her". Brittney even believed this too. But they proved that it was all lies. Morgan's been convincing Brittney that her mother doesn't love her so she'd have to depend on him. She may be an adult but it's clear the way she's been brought up has left her emotionally vulnerable, which I believe that Morgan is taking advantage of. Also they did prove he was cheating on her. From what I've seen he doesn't love her at all (as a daughter or a lover), he just sees her as a "tool" for sex.
ReplyDeleteThanks for your feedback. Everything has to be taken with a grain of salt (or a whole lot more salt) when it comes to these shows. I would not be the least bit surprised if none of what has been said in those episodes is real.
DeleteTotally true, FME. Still, I think Anon has the appropraite attitude: trust, but verify. He allows that consent is possible, and that we should legally allow consenting adults to have the kind of relationships they want. That still doesn't mean that we shouldn't be suspicious when specific circumstances give us reason to think there's something emotionally/physically abusive/coercive going on. We should evaluate relationships individually. That's part of why I think the taboo is stupid: it fails to make a distinction between healthy and abusive relationships.
DeleteIf you don't think this is abuse, you have serious problems.
ReplyDeleteIts just wrong to have sexual relationship with your own kid's you really got to be messed up in your head to think it's OK to do that!!!!!!!
ReplyDeleteAnonymous, if that is what you think, then don't do it. But other people should be free to be together if they want. There are many mentally healthy people who are in such relationships.
DeleteThen the relationship isn't healthy
DeleteBrittany should be 23 or 24 by now but when she was on the show she was a very immature 18. He was preying on her. If he had truly loved her he would not have cheated on her. Her childhood trauma damaged her. As a victim if childhood rape and molestation myself, i will say that it is extremely damaging and leaves a person open to vulnerabilities that if not monitored closely someone will take advantage of him/her. A man should be the adult and not let this relationship happen. I am all about two consenting adults being free to be together BUT a father should never be sexually involved with his daughter ESPECIALLY when the young woman seems traumatized as this young woman does. I won't even talk about the two of them reproducing.
ReplyDeleteA father and his adult daughter can have a healthy relationship and there is no reason to criminalize or otherwise discriminate against them in the law. We don't have to LIKE everyone's relationships or think they are healthy, but we should recognize that adults should be treated as adults.
DeleteMorgan and Brittny had "discussed" reproducing but decided against it. Thank heaven for small favors!
DeleteThankfully, Brittny is out of that sick relationship with her dad. She was on another update show. Good for you, Brittny and congrats on your new relationship !!
ReplyDelete